Carnivore Diet, Raw Beans, Lectin Myths, Pre-Sleep Gelatin, Apple Peels & More - Q&A Episode With Joel Greene!

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By Ben Greenfield. Discovered by Player FM and our community — copyright is owned by the publisher, not Player FM, and audio is streamed directly from their servers. Hit the Subscribe button to track updates in Player FM, or paste the feed URL into other podcast apps.

It's time for Part 3 of my monster podcast series with author Joel Greene, in which Joel hops on for an epic solosode to answer all your burning questions, including:

  • How does "The Carnivore Code" affect Crohn's disease?
  • Should you cook beans, or eat them raw?
  • How much gelatin should you eat before bed or in the afternoon?
  • If apple peel is the first way forward, my question is how much apple peel should we aim for? And what's the best color apple?
  • How should we take human milk oligosaccharides (HMO)?
  • Any thoughts on taking pectin powder (like the kind used to make jellies) in order to feed Akkermansia?
  • Can you take apple peels and predigest them like sauerkraut?
  • Is there a clean baby formula or another supplement you can recommend?
  • What are the dangers of MCT oil supplementation?
  • What’s your opinion of Nuchido Time+ NAD supplements?
  • Do I do the 2 weeks of apple skins, HMO, and phenol powder before I attempt any of the other modules?
  • Do I do the Daisy Cutter protocol right away or wait until later? At what point do I add the other modules in?
  • What is Joel’s one-day B vitamin protocol?
  • What is your source of HMO? Which brand and product?

If you missed part 1, in which we discuss rebooting your gut and sparking fat loss using some very unique biohacks and strategies, you can listen to it at "How To Reboot The Gut, Eat Cheesecake Without Gaining Weight, Amplify Any Fasting Protocol & Maximize Fat Loss."

You can hear part 2 at "Joel Greene Podcast Part 2: How To Reshape Fat Cells, Enhance Repair During Sleep, Target Your "Circaseptan Rhythms," Build Young Muscle & Get Rid Of Old Muscle."

You can also, check out Joel's guest post on my blog entitled "Your Body Fat Is Your Immune System’s Mothership: The Mysterious Relationship Between Fat Cells & Immunity."

So, who is Joel Greene, exactly?

To put it simply, he's a man who had his 10,000 hours in before I was even born.

  • In the 1970s, he was interval training.
  • In 1979, he was doing Olympic lifts for three hours every night.
  • In the 80s, he began studying MCTs.
  • In 1990, he began studying the keto diet.
  • In the early 90s, he was doing what would be called intermittent fasting today.
  • In the mid 90s, he experienced the rebound from chronic starvation.
  • In the late 90s, he went through his clean eating phase, his macro phase, and his ancestral diet phase.
  • By 2001, he had his first nutrition website publishing cutting edge research.
  • By 2006, he came to the end of all the above and discovered none of it worked over time and under real-life pressure.
  • In 2007, he authored the first article for the health and fitness community based on the new science linking gut bacteria and obesity.
  • In 2008, his website lookcut.com hit #2 on Google for weight loss—with over 1,000 original groundbreaking articles that today represent many of the most widely copied ideas in nutrition.
  • In 2009, he launched the world's first diet system based on targeting gut bacteria.
  • In 2010, he was implementing signal activation of the AMPK pathway. The gurus only began speaking to AMPK in 2017.
  • By 2013, he had the world's largest body of anecdotal outcomes for body composition targeting the gut bacteria.
  • In 2013, he published the first article to the health and fitness community on the dangers of MCT oil supplementation.

Today—at 53, on 1 workout a week, eating whatever, whenever, with no drugs, SARMS, prohormones, or ergogenic aids ever—he is the world leader in hacking the body. He is the real deal. He has done it longer and has always been far ahead. He looks it, he lives it. What the gurus say is impossible, he was living every day before they were gurus.

He has hacked peak human…

Working out once per week…

Eating whatever, whenever…

…and does it all on fast food!

He is the future of real-world health and nutrition, today.

Joel is the creator of the VEEP Nutrition System, the world's first commercially available program based on targeting gut communities to effect biomarkers. He is a featured author, speaker, and guest in top tier publications such as Muscle and Fitness, 24 Hour Fitness Digital Magazine, CBS Online, Superhuman Radio, and beyond. His system has also been featured on the Dr. Phil Show, where it has delivered astounding life-changing results.

He is the future of real-world health and nutrition—today, and his new book was one of the most nitty-gritty deep dives into “rebooting your body” that I've ever read. The Immunity Code is simply a new paradigm and an entirely new way to think about caring for your body. The new goal is learning to control immunity, health, and aging using new science-based techniques (or hacks, if you will) to steer immunity for health and to slow, or even reverse, aging. ​

This book will change everything you know about your body. Starting with simple easy to-dos that build one on top of the other, you will emerge with a powerful understanding of how your body really works and how to control it over time, in the real world. Simply put, you will jump 10 years ahead of anything else on the shelf today.

In this episode, you'll discover: -Crohn's disease and the carnivore diet...7:05
  • The Carnivore Code podcast about Crohn's disease
  • The Truth About The Carnivore Diet: Everything You Need To Know About Dangers, Benefits, Mistakes & Hacks For Eating Only Meat, With Dr. Paul Saladino.
  • Going purely plant-based may show short-term benefit, but long-term harm
  • What will heal the gut?
  • Oil and gas in the engine: the order in which it is added is essential
  • Structure-function of the gut:
    • Essential foods based on how the gut works
    • Diet that's high in fish and fiber may be the most beneficial
    • High meat and omega 6 fats may increase susceptibility to Crohn's disease
  • Gut and colon exist in a state of extreme oxidative stress (normal for the colon)
  • The colon is where most digestion takes place
    • Butyrate is the primary fuel of colonocytes, the cells lining the colon
    • When you use the saccharolytic pathway to fiber, you get antioxidants and short-chain fatty acids (SCFA)
    • When you use amino acids to make butyrate, you get short SCFAs and ammonia
  • When the right bacteria in place is given fiber, you get:
    • Optimal amounts of butyrate
    • Moderate amounts of propionate and acetate
  • Fatty liver a result of too much acetate
  • Macrophages in the colon are adapted to ignore inflammatory signals like interleukin 1β (IL-1β)
    • Antioxidants maintain this colonic homeostasis
  • When the colon is deprived of antioxidants...
    • Ascorbate levels in the colonic walls go down
    • Inflammatory mediators like tumor necrosis factor-alpha (TNFα) is elevated, shutting off butyrate transport (gut can't make use of butyrate)
  • Crohn's disease is characterized by...
    • A loss of butyrate-producing species of bacteria
    • A gain of methane-producing species of bacteria
  • Butyrate is also made from amino acids and other proteins
  • Butyrate from amino acids gives:
    • SCFAs
    • Ammonia
  • Sustained production of ammonia gives cancer-promoting alkylated carbonyls
    • Higher alkalinity in the colon will lead to cancer
  • Fiber and plants are the optimal way to feed the colon
  • Long term production of butyrate from sources other than fiber gives you...
    • A lack of antioxidants
    • Ammonia
    • SCFA imbalances
  • Lower gut is fed by plants
  • Upper gut is fed by animal foods
    • Animal proteins are the best source of amino acids
    • Amino acids with niacin (also abundant in meat) are beneficial for the gut
-Diet strategies for improving mental health...17:50
  • Studies done on mice are limited in their efficacy to treat humans' mental health
  • Changes in gut biome give a bump in energy, but not big differences in mood
  • Reductions in body fat and improvements in metabolism are correlated with improved mood, ameliorating depression
  • Research project headed by Dr. Ryan D'Arcy, a type of "FitBit or Oura Ring for the brain" (wearable for the brain)
    • Maps and measures the impact of various specific indices of cognitive performance such as mood, depression, recall, etc.
    • Measures how changes in the gut biome can affect mood, depression, energy, etc.
-Raw beans and toxic lectins...24:00
  • Cook then cool down beans
  • Not all lectins are toxic; many have large health benefits
    • Chick pea lectins inhibit breast cancer
    • Banana lectins can slow the growth of liver cancer
    • Concanavalin, a legume lectin, kills certain types of cancer in mice and ameliorates diabetes and HIV in humans
    • Human lectins are essential for immunity
-How much gelatin to eat after lunch and before bed...25:00
  • ~100 grams via 5 cal. jello
  • Bedtime intake results in body fat reduction
  • Glycine in the jello tends to sensitize adiponectin and helps improve insulin sensitivity
  • During the day, it helps with hunger pangs while dieting strictly
-How much, and what color apple peels are the best?...25:45
  • Red apples due to color pigments
  • Not an exact science on the amounts due to individual tolerances
  • Start small, titrate your dose up due to your own tolerance
  • Strains of bacteria in the gut will affect the best intake
-Should we take human milk oligosaccharides (HMO) powder dry, or in a smoothie...26:45
  • A smoothie with the HMO powder, apple peel, and red phenols mixed with whey protein is the easy way...
  • BEN, WOULD ORGANIFI RED BE A GOOD OPTION FOR RED PHENOL POWDER? THE AMAZON RESULTS CURRENTLY LINKED GIVE SOME PRETTY VARIED OPTIONS.
-Citrus pectin and feeding Akkermansia bacteria...27:20
  • Citrus pectin is similar to apple peel in terms of polysaccharides; don't absorb very well in the gut unless heated
  • Does not really feed Akkermansia
  • What citrus pectins do is prevent cancer
-Can you take apple peels and pre-digest them like sauerkraut?..28:10
  • Fermentation is what makes bacteria; the idea is to make bacteria in the gut
-A clean baby formula Joel recommends...28:35
  • There are a lot of HMO products in the market right now and more coming out soon
-What are the dangers of MCT oil supplementation? Should we be "gluten scared"?...29:25 -NAD supplements and inflammation...30:20 -How to introduce Joel's apple peel protocol into your diet...31:20
  • Not done all the time but have to do periodically (done whenever needed)
  • Immune-related and immune-centric issues in the gut are targeted
-Should you start the two-day core eating right away?...32:30
  • Two-day core eating is meant to solve declining bifidobacteria with age, ageing in general, sleep disruption, etc.
-Should one begin the daisy-cutter protocol right away, and how often should you do it?...33:30
  • It's not for the faint of heart; only do it if you're prepared physically and mentally
  • Once a year max
-When to do Joel's B vitamin protocol...35:00
  • It is kind of a test that you do when you feel you need energy
-Does NAD increase inflammation?...35:55
  • Immune cell metabolism is the underlying issue
-Joel's preferred source of HMO...37:30
  • Baby formula does the job
-Questions from Raja at Seed Probiotics about research Joel cited in previous podcasts...38:10
  • What is the primary fuel source of colonocytes?
  • In the intestines, glutamine is the main fuel source of the enterocytes
  • Butyrate levels in the colon are more important than glutamine
  • Akkermansia levels in lean vs. obese people; men vs. women
    • Japanese herb Kampo
  • Insufficient human evidence for polyphenols stimulating Akkermansia
  • How cold exposure affects Akkermansia
  • Prebiotics blunt the effects of TNFα
Resources from this episode:

- Joel Greene:

- Other resources:

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