Making the Switch to a Full Time Artist w/ Brooke Glaser

Design Tribe Podcast

Are you ready to quit your full time job and become a full time, independent artist? This video is for you!

Brooke Glaser, an independent illustrator, tells us all about how she became a full time artist even though she flopped the first time.

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TRANSCRIPT

Speaker 1: 00:00 Hey, what's up fools. This is your host, Lauren. Lastly with the design tribe podcast based out of Beautiful Birmingham. Yep. You heard that right? We've moved. This is the podcast version of my webinar series. You'll find on my website at laurenlesley.com Lesley is spelled with an e y. We'll be discussing all things related to the design side of your online business and interviewing creative entrepreneurs. If you'd like to watch the video version of this episode, you will be able to follow along with awesome slides that I made. Super Pretty and you'll get to interact with me in the comments. I also go live in the design tribe Facebook group. If you'd rather tune in there to sign up for show episodes, go to LaurenLesley.com/webinar-series or if you'd like to join our Facebook community, check out facebook.com/groups/DesignTribeLaurenLesley, thanks for connecting with the design tribe. Let's start the conversation.

Speaker 2: 01:12 Hi, what's up everyone? Thanks for tuning into the design tribe today. We have an amazing special guest, Brooke Glaser. She's going to tell us all about how to make this switch to becoming a full time artist. So Brooke, will you tell us a little bit about yourself, your background, and how you became a full-time illustrator?

Speaker 3: 01:33 Yeah, so I'm Brooke Glaser. Um, I do work that is, you can find on greeting cards and gift wrap and bags, children's apparel, home decor and magazines. Um, I'm also a teacher on skillshare where I have, uh, several popular courses like intro to procreate and making the living for artists. I've been working for myself since 2010 kind of on and off. So I worked in house as a textile designer. Um, I also worked as a designer for an ad agency and I even did a short little stint at a toy company. So I've kind of seen both sides of the coin working as an artist and also working on the company side. But basically I've always wanted to just make cute stuff and I wanted to work for myself. I've always, always, always wanted to work for myself. That's kind of a, a big thing for me.

Speaker 3: 02:24 And, um, so since about 2010, I've been, I've been working for myself on and off and I tried to make the leap to full time artist many, many times actually. And I fought, I fought like I totally fell on my face and had no idea what I was doing and, um, had to go into full time work cause I like ran out of money or it really just felt very directionless. And so it took me a long time to really get a really clear direction of what I wanted to do and then figure out how to do it and how to make it work. Um, but hopefully I'll be to share a couple of

Speaker 2: 03:00 tips that helped me out and hopefully help some people avoid some of the mistakes that I made. So yeah, I think that's going to be super valuable for all of our listeners and viewers. Um, and thanks for telling us a little bit about, you know, how you, you know, kind of failed the first time that, um, that's really interesting and it gives you a lot of, um, I dunno, I guess a lot of credibility in terms of, you know, what not to do and then to make you sick. All right. So I guess as a first step, if you're wanting to become an illustrator or a full time artist, uh, in your opinion, do you need to go to art school to become independent or like as you, as you're getting started, you know, like you, should you work for a company first? Should you go to schools? Do you need that degree to kind of get started?

Speaker 3: 03:47 Um, so as far as art art school goes to, I didn't go to art school. I actually went to film school. Uh, and I did a lot of art stuff. And I don't want to say that like, like traditional college is a worthless, cause. It's, there's a lot of great things about school. I think there's a lot of stuff that you really don't need to go into debt for. A lot of this stuff can be learned online. And even like I've, like I said, I have a skill share course on making, living in art as an artist where I teach things like pricing and how to find clients and like all lots of nitty gritty stuff. And those things are not stuff that you need to go to school to learn. But there are some things that I think, um, in person interaction and school really does well that is harder to do online and that would be like creating, um, creative connections, building, building connections.

Speaker 3: 04:41 Because like if you're going to a school, you, you are probably going to have professors who are hopefully connected in the industry, can introduce you to people who can hire you or um, you know, a lot of schools have like career days where companies come in. I know hallmark hallmark tires, a lot of people, um, from like school fairs. So like that's something that you, you're going to struggle a little bit more finding online. And I also think that it's really important to learn like how to take creative critique because I'm not great at that. It's very painful. Like I'm so attached to my art, I, it's me don't tell me it's bad, but like that is like 100% part of like the working relationship is learning how to like take those critiques. And I think school does a good job of showing you that that's harder to do online as well. So,

Speaker 2: 05:31 yeah, that's, that's interesting. I like how you said it's not worth going into like a major amount of debt over because I feel like that's my big thing is I see, I've seen a lot of artists are, a lot of people, I guess go to art school and then they have to end up getting a different job that's not even creative because they're just massive amounts of debt and maybe, I dunno, maybe the school wasn't really great at fostering those connections with companies like hallmark, like you, like you said. Um, but it is great. I mean, not that, yeah, I like, not that it's worthless or not that it doesn't teach you. Um,

Speaker 3: 06:04 and I think that is a really, really big thing, um, to consider, especially if you are wanting to go into business for yourself because when you are in debt, like having that financial stress of like, oh, I've got like a $600 student loan bill that I have to pay this this month. Um, puts a lot of stress that is, makes it hard to do other things. So I think community colleges are great. I think state universities are great. I think, you know, like all of that. If you can get a full ride, heck yeah. Go to an art school, go to an art institute, that's amazing. Do it. So. Right, right.

Speaker 2: 06:38 I totally agree. And if you can't get a full ride or you know, a big scholarship, then I would say exactly what you said. Go to a state school or go to basically you're a cheapest option that kind of gives you that degree and you can learn. But, um, there is a lot of online learning you can do on top of that so you can kind of fill in the gaps

Speaker 3: 06:58 if it's not the best school that, you know. And I think, I think school is really great if you are somebody who has a hard time, um, maybe setting deadlines or, or restrictions on yourself, like, oh, I'm going to do this thing, then it's really great to be like, Oh, I'm in class. Like I'm putting money down. Um, but honestly, like almost everything I think can be taught online. Like there's so much great information. I mean, youtube is free. Skillshare is incredible. There's creative live, which also does a lot of teaching. There's creative bug. There's so, so, so, so much though.

Speaker 2: 07:32 Right. All right, well cool. I'm glad to get your opinion on that. Um, it definitely aligns with my thoughts as well. All right. So if you're already working as a designer and you're dreaming about going out on your own as you have experienced, um, and I have as well, and being your own boss, what are some of the key first steps

Speaker 3: 07:52 that you need to take? Um, so what I can say from my own experience is that, um, you want to be really specific about what it is that you want to be doing. Um, for me, like maybe I was just thinking at first like, oh, I just want to make art, I just going to make this like art that I enjoy making and, and I don't know, I'll just find somebody, but the more specific you can get about it, like the more success that you're going to have on like actually making money at it. So you want to think really specifically about what companies or clients you'd like to have and um, really think about what kind of work would they buy and make exactly that kind of work. So, for example, like if you're doing greeting cards, you don't want to just do greeting cards, like just like put any kind of art under greeting card, go to the store, see the different sections.

Speaker 3: 08:43 Like there's birthday cards, there's wedding cards, look at the color palettes that they're using. Look at, um, how many birthday cards versus how many sympathy cards do they sell? Well, obviously if it's a bigger birthday card section, they buy more birthday art. So you want to be thinking about art that you can make that burnt. They are to whatever, you know, um, and it's not that you have to do exactly what they're doing. Like it's totally fine to do your own unique take, but it's important that you do the research and understand what it is, um, why people are doing, why companies are doing those things. So the biggest thing is having a good portfolio of work. Even if it's just like six pieces, um, that you're proud of, that a company could look at and say, Oh yeah, that works for us. We can take that right away.

Speaker 2: 09:31 Yeah, that's really interesting because you, especially as a new artist starting out, you're probably trying to figure out which direction to go in. And if you wanted to do something like greeting cards, you might, you know, it's good to know like, okay, what categories am I designing for such as birthday or wedding, but you also want to offer something different and that's kind of in your own style. You know, you don't want to offer them something that they already have because that's not going to be exciting or you know, show something different for their line.

Speaker 3: 10:00 Yeah, and I, and I would also say it like that's such a fine balance too, because I think a lot of companies that are like, oh, this worked really well, so let's just do another version of it. So it's not exclusively like, yes, it has to be total unique and out of the box. But I think I'm most artists what to do something unique and different. Like, I don't know, I don't want to just like copy everything that's out there. So, yeah, totally. You're so right.

Speaker 2: 10:25 Okay. So the next question is, do you need to save six months of your salary? We kind of hear that anyway, as we're starting our first job or whatever. And I've never been able to do that. I'm just going to be honest. But um, if you're trying to go out on your own as an independent artist, is that something that you absolutely need to do to kind of get started?

Speaker 3: 10:47 Uh, I have also never saved six months. Uh, so a bad, bad entrepreneur. Um, but definitely at least three. Like I really would like encourage people to do three months. Some people do really well with having this pressure of like, oh no, I have to make money and making it work. Uh, there's also that fine balance of like, again, having financial stresses as hard to, it's hard to be productive, um, when you're scared just out of your mind. Um, but you really do as like a, as an illustrator, you really do need to have leeway because, um, even if you are working, you might not get paid right away. So if you're licensing, you might not see money coming in for a year because it takes a year from them buying the art or licensing the Ark and producing the, um, whatever it is, and then putting it into stores and then getting your payment. Even with like, you know, graphic design clients or whatever. Like you might have like net 30. So when you build a client, they may not pay you for 30 days or 15 days and you can set those terms for yourself. But again, it's not going to be like you're going to get a regular paycheck in most cases, um, like, like clockwork. So you just need to have that, that leeway, that extra money so that you can keep going and keep paying your utilities.

Speaker 2: 12:13 Right. So I'm interested to hear a little bit more about how you did it in your personal story. So you saved three months and then did you have to go back to work full time? Because I know, I mean, I'm trying to license designs as well and I'm lucky because I can like lean on my husband a little bit. He's like covering the rent while I'm like trying to build this because yeah, you're not going to, if you're licensing, you're not going to get paid for a year or sometimes even two years is what I hear. And I'm just getting started with this. So I can't really give too much advice of what I wouldn't do because I'm still figuring it out. But um, how do you sort of like fill in the gaps with your income if you've only stayed for three months but then you're not getting paid for like a year out?

Speaker 3: 12:52 Right. Um, yeah cause you're like, well how do I keep doing this if I have to go to a full time job again? Like it's like super stressful. Um, so, uh, the, I'm thinking specifically of the first time that I did that. Yeah. I think I said three months and I was like, I had no idea what I was doing and just like ran out of money and had to get a job. And so that was really crappy. And what worked the second time around was that I got a part time job and that was like my saving grace. Um, so I the, I've, I've done it twice, uh, two different ways. I've had like, um, creative part time jobs and doing that kind of work like absolutely drained me creatively and I really wasn't able to be as productive as I wanted to be when I um, went, got off of work and tried to do like my, um, my own personal illustration work.

Speaker 3: 13:48 What really worked well for me was getting noncreative jobs. So like I worked at a yoga studio and because I do aerial silks and they did aerial silk classes, so I got like really discounted aerial folks classes and I just worked at the front desk. So it was, it was super low pressure. It didn't take a lot of my creative energy and it helped me, um, supplement those bills as I started building up my clientele. Um, you could easily do this with a serving job or a retail job, especially anything that gives you flexibility so that you can, um, okay. Hopefully set your hours a little bit so that you're taking advantage of your, the hours that you're most productive, whether that's morning or nighttime or whatever. And I'm going to go into the non creative job when you're, when you're not.

Speaker 2: 14:34 That's a really interesting point. I wouldn't have thought to go to a non creative Java. I mean I've um, I've, I haven't had to work part time but I have considered freelancing again, um, for like an in textile design since that's my background while I'm trying to build my licensing. But that's interesting that you, you're saying that that drains you and it actually kind of like maybe hurt your life licensing side a little bit. Whereas if you are in a non creative job, you're kind of like waiting all day to get home and be able to make something.

Speaker 3: 15:03 Yeah, I think that was probably the key motivator because I was like, ah, I don't, like when I worked at urban job, I was like, I don't want to be doing this. I hate this. Why am I doing this? And that, that like really like motivated me to do that too. Although I will say that, um, like doing like freelance creative work is totally legit. Like that's a great way to do it because you get to set your own hours and your own rates. And I mean that's, that's creative work right there. And like you, as you build up the other stuff, you can just cut that stuff away. So unless he liked doing and then you do it.

Speaker 2: 15:35 Yeah, no, I liked doing it. It's just, I think I'm a little bit like, oh, like would it be a conflict of interest if I'm freelancing for this company and then I want to license something that's like in the same industry, you know what I mean? So like that's my only hesitation right now and I'm just going to have to like talk to them and see if that's something that they would care about or not.

Speaker 3: 15:55 Yeah. Well, and I would say that if you were in house then that would be in your contract that no, you're not gonna, you're not gonna compete. But if you're a freelancer, you have to do that. How else are you going to pay your bills if you aren't like working for as many people as possible? Like obviously they'd probably be like a nondisclosure agreement where you can't let them know like their competitors know anything about their way that they do business or the trends that they're going for. But so yeah, that that's true. That could, that could totally vary by company to company. But I don't think it's fair for somebody to ask a freelancer to be exclusive personally. Yes. He says the one who is not running the business that cares about,

Speaker 2: 16:37 I think I'm just so used to being in house that I'm like, oh no. Like I can't do, you know, rug designs for myself if I'm doing it for them. But yeah.

Speaker 3: 16:45 Well yeah, like I know a lot of companies won't even let you freelance like on anything. Well some companies won't let you even like do like your own side projects, which I think of crazy. Yeah, it's a little,

Speaker 2: 16:55 it's a little controlling. All right. So the next question is, in order to become independent, do you have need to have like your own established art style before you really make that leap so that you, you know, kind of have I guess, your own voice, um, or your own aesthetic as you're moving forward and as you're going independent into your own business?

Speaker 3: 17:18 Um, I think the most important thing is that you have a way of standing out and having like a distinct style is like a really great way of doing that. Um, but the bigger picture being that like it's your strengths. What is it that you are really good at that you can do but that not everyone else can do. And that could be your style. Like, like literally how you draw. Um, but it could also be like the kinds of things that you do. Like if you're really good at lettering, you should lean into that cause not everybody can do lettering, um, or are really, um, good at your presentation of your art. Like that. Not Everybody's great at that either in that can help you stand out. Are you really good with people? Like how can you put yourself in a position where you are dealing with people in person because you're really good at in person interactions.

Speaker 3: 18:05 And some artists are like very introverted and not really good at talking to people or being on the phone. Um, like for example, I'm really comfortable in front of a camera and so I like talking to people and so video is what helps me to stand out from other artists and I'll make videos of myself. Like I do like teaching online. Um, I do videos with my art that helps me to stand out. If you're a good photographer then like you should be taking photos of your work and like a lifestyle photo of, of your art can be a lot more eye catching sometimes than just the art itself. Um, yeah. And, and style also like, um, isn't just necessarily how you draw something, but it could be like your sense of humor. Like, if you're really good at puns or like conceptual work, having that really conceptual strong ideas can help you stand out from other artists who just make like me just cute things, you know?

Speaker 2: 18:58 Yeah. Cool. All right, well the next question is, how do you find clients once you go full time and how long can you, can you expect it to take before you can expect to make a full time income again? So I know we kind of touched on that with the licensing and it can take a year or sometimes two years before you can make a full time income and maybe you can supplement with a part time job. Um, but how are you going to find clients once you do you go full time and how long can that take?

Speaker 3: 19:29 Um, so, so these really are two different questions. Um, uh, yeah, so I'll dive into like how you can, uh, find clients, because I could probably go on like this forever, but, um, so there's a ton of ways to find clients. Um, you can go shopping and anytime that you go shopping and you see something that looks like, uh, oh, that's really cute and illustrated piece or whatever, look at the back of it, see what the tag says, find them, take a photo of the tag, see who manufactured it and look them up. That's a potential client right there. Um, you can do trade shows, there's lots of different trade shows for different markets, but you can also research trade shows. So for example, I like to do art that's really good for kids clothes or just like children's market. So I was like, oh, what could I, what, who would buy this kind of artwork and children's clothing?

Speaker 3: 20:25 So what I did was I looked up trade shows where people who've made children's clothing, where they sold their art or their, not their art there, their clothes or their products or whatever. And so when you look at, when you research those kinds of trade shows, you can see a list of WHO's exhibiting. And all of those people were potential clients for me. Um, and I didn't have to even go to the show. Like, I could just do that research. Um, there's also a book called [inaudible], the artist and graphic, the graphic, an artist's market book. That's probably not the right word, but it's, um, you can, yeah.

Speaker 2: 21:04 Did they do it in the notes and, um, you can, you can let me know what it is.

Speaker 3: 21:10 So it's, I find it to be a little bit outdated, but like what it does is it basically lists in different categories, all these different companies that have historically purchased artwork and it's quite thick. And it, you still need to do the research to see like, Hey, is this a company that my artwork would actually fit for? But it does list in theory like contact information and what kind of art and how much aren't they, they usually buy per year. So it, I wouldn't like totally rely on the information in there, but it's a really great place to start looking. Um, and like all of this work obviously has a lot of research involved and if you're like really not that into research, like I am, um, you can get a collective together. So when I um, started out again on my own, I started a collective called Pencil parade and we pooled all of our resources to uh, do the marketing.

Speaker 3: 22:04 So like not just our financial resources but our time resources. So everybody was saying like, Oh, here's some clients that we could work with. Here is some clients that we could work with. These are different great markets that we'd like to work in. Um, and we split the effort of, of sharing new work with those clients. So once, so that's kind of the first half of finding clients. The second half is sending them work. You really have to always, always be sending them new work. Like every month it took me like they're my biggest client now. I wrote them for six months and they didn't buy anything and after six months now there, they bought their first piece and like they've been a repeat client since then. So always sending new work even if you don't hear anything back. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 22:48 Yeah. That's interesting because I guess if you're not hearing anything back, you might think, oh, it's not a good fit or they're not into my look or whatever. So how do you kind of balance between, um, I mean, do you just continue to send everyone that you think would be interested new work or do you have a way of sort of filtering

Speaker 3: 23:06 got out? Right. Cause it's kind of like a lot of artists and hundreds of people work every month, like all the time. And I, I wouldn't do that. So for me, what I would do is I would get really specific, say like, Hey, is my work actually a fit for this company? Like would this work actually do well? Could that get, I actually see this okay. Um, in their lineup and then, um, if the answer is yes, you know, uh, I would probably write for like a year and if you don't hear back after a year, maybe it's just time to move on and, uh, to a new strategy or, or something else. I think six months a year is a real, like sometimes silence means no, but sometimes silence means they have so much going on and they don't have time to reply to everybody. Art Directors are really, really busy people.

Speaker 3: 23:57 They can get hundreds of emails, you know, all the time and they like literally don't have time to reply back and say, oh, this is great. Um, I'm sending it to a presentation or oh, you know, we just bought for this season so we don't need anymore. Or, uh, this will be great in three months. You, you really, really, really do not know why they're not replying. Because in order for them to be replying, that would be a fulltime job and their full time job is making the art. So, um, there's another couple of ways. Uh, so I use MailChimp to send out newsletters and if I can see that somebody is always opening my newsletter, even if they're not replying to me, I'm going to keep sending them stuff because they're reading it, they're looking at it. Um, MailChimp gives you like a, I've read this thing. Um, there's also, uh, an APP for chrome. I use Gmail and it's called streak. And you can also see if people have been opening your emails. And again, so like if people are reading my emails, I'm going to keep sending them. And if nobody like I can't see that they're not answering my emails. They're not opening. Well who knows? You don't actually know if they're not opening. You only know if they actually are. Um, I can give you like a

Speaker 2: 25:16 false negative. I'm sorry, I'm like rambling, rambling on all good idea. Here's an idea. All good information though and okay, so if you're sending some of these companies new art every single month, how much is too much or too little to send them?

Speaker 3: 25:35 Um, I would say that. Okay, think about it this way. You are like, imagine that you get a hundred emails a week from people. You want this to be short and easy. So you really want to like see what the artists and decide yes or no. So I would send at most eight pieces and at least honestly you can even set, if you have like a PR the perfect piece for somebody just send one, it's fine. Um, but, but honestly I tend to do anywhere from two to four, two to six. Um, I would also, if you can attach it into the actual body of the email, because a lot of people can't open attachments for work. So either I would attach jpegs to the email or I would embed it like, you know, when you can like copy and paste it. Okay.

Speaker 2: 26:29 Yeah, that's interesting. Cause when I was following up after blueprint, I wanted to like put everything in a zip file to like make it smaller. But if they can just open it and see it immediately, that's probably easier for you.

Speaker 3: 26:39 And, and for, for them, they might have instructions not to open zip files because, because like, especially at big corporations, they like it. They're like, oh, we don't trust you not to download a virus. No Zip files for you.

Speaker 2: 26:55 I didn't know that. That's interesting.

Speaker 3: 26:57 I've only worked at smaller like manufacturers and whatnot. So, yeah. Well, yeah, I worked at a smaller one too and they were like very like, no, be careful. Be Very careful.

Speaker 2: 27:07 Cool. This is probably just the tech person, not necessarily the size of the company, it's just whoever's the tech person. I hear you. I hear you. All right. So what are some different routes that illustrators can go down in terms of industries? You mentioned you design things for like children's industry, whether it's clothing or whatnot, but you know, when I was like growing up in high school and even in college, I used to think that illustrators only worked on children's books. So that's, I mean, that's crazy to me now, but like if you, if you've never been in the industry, if you, if you're not a designer yet, you might not understand exactly like what are the industries you can work in. So if you'll tell us like, what are the other types of jobs that are available and like what's important for illustrators or is it important for illustrators to diversify in, you know, among different industries when they do go solo?

Speaker 3: 27:59 Yeah, totally. Um, yeah I didn't, I didn't even know that like surface design was a thing until like five years ago.

Speaker 2: 28:07 But you weren't the rugs. I mean that's, well I did. Yeah, eventually I did. So I was an oil painting major in school so that tells you like in double majored in art history and then I did graphic design for four years cause I was like, Oh I guess this is the next best thing to being a fine artist. You know? And I hate to graphic design. And then as I was in that job, that's when I started seeing these other artists that were designing a lot of patterns and how I was like, oh like how do you get that career? Like I've never heard of this. Like no one in my, you know, liberal arts school like mentioned. So it's funny. Yeah. So I figured it out eventually. But you know, when I was choosing a major and all of that, yeah, I didn't, I had no clue what surface

Speaker 3: 28:45 that was totally my experience too because I was like, oh, well if I want to make money as an artist, I have to be a graphic designer, a web designer. And that's like I am. I did it and I hated it and I was really not that good at it either, not my thing. Um, and for me in my head it was like, oh, either you like have like an Etsy store and you make crafts or you are a fine artist. And so actually that, um, that there are kind of like two splits of making money as an, as an artist. Um, one way is working with companies and the other is selling to customers. So, um, and like in boring business terms, that would be like B two B business to business or B to c business to customer or consumer or whatever. But that's boring.

Speaker 3: 29:30 Let's not talk about it that, right. Um, so as an example, if you sell greeting cards in your Etsy shop that's working with customers, you are selling to customers directly. And if you sell your art to hallmark who makes greeting cards and they sell it to their customers, that's working with a company. And the only reason that I bring this up is because that the way that you, um, market yourself to those two, those two different ways like working to customers versus companies is different. The way that you try and sell to them is totally different. Um, and I kind of talk about this more in my making a living, uh, as an artist class, kind of like the different pros and cons and the differences of Blah, blah blah. But like in like the business side, like, you know, if you're working with companies, you could be working for magazines doing like editorial stuff and that could be like anywhere from, uh, you know, there's food magazines and there's like sports magazines if feel like illustrating sports things.

Speaker 3: 30:32 But like a lot of like portraiture gets done in those magazines. Like, you know, like maybe like a little illustration of the author or the team who works on the magazine. Um, let alone just the topics that the magazine covers itself. Um, there's also, like you were saying like the textile and home decor, uh, kind of work and there's greeting cards and stationery, fashion and apparel. There's video games. Uh, there's TV and animation. Like there's like concept artists who make backgrounds and like the ideas for what a character would look like. And that's like a whole nother industry itself. Um, there's advertising which can be anything from the packaging on, um, soap or cereal boxes to murals on the inside of like the apple store. Um, and then there's like you were saying books, so that could be children's books. That could be like if you go into the bookstore, there's a whole world of other kinds of books too, so you don't have to be into kids' stuff.

Speaker 3: 31:32 Um, graphic novels and comics. And that's all on the business side if you're just working with businesses. But if you want to just do exclusively your own thing, like you can also open an online store where you make stickers and pins and prints and all of that stuff. And then you can be selling to your own customers. Um, you can self publish your own books, you can teach art, you can, um, sell your art wholesale to other retailers who sell it in their stores. Um, you can do in person markets. Um, I think, I think I've, I've, I've, I've gotten enough over this, but there's like tons and tons of ways, um, and different markets that you can, that you can work in

Speaker 2: 32:14 and so awesome to hear the variety and like you can just see all the different personalities that were you working in these different industries. Yeah, totally. Um, okay.

Speaker 3: 32:23 And you are still right. Um, uh, diversity is really important to actually diversifying your income streams. Um, for example, like when the 2008 crash happened, like if you had had all of your money coming from one company, um, you could have been absolutely devastated, but it's really important that you do a variety of work. And actually like you're, you're likely that you're going to need to, um, a lot of licensing deals. Like you don't make that much money in them. So like, you need to make sure that you're, you're working some with this one company in some with this company. Um, and, and a good mix of like having money that's coming in right away versus licensing and passive income. Like there's, it's really important to have a whole mix of all of that.

Speaker 2: 33:09 I know you have your skillshare classes and you also have a youtube channel, um, which is awesome, but is that a good way to also kind of supplement your income as an illustrator if you're not afraid to like get on camera or work with people and kind of, um, you know, get in front of people and teach.

Speaker 3: 33:23 Yeah. Um, so this was, this is something that I also did as a part time job. Um, even before online, like I worked at a museum and I taught art classes. I worked in art schools. Uh, I taught adults and kids like a, have you ever done like any of those? Like, um, have you ever seen any of those like a drink and paint classes where like, everybody's got like a glass of wine that's, those are really great steady sources of income for artists and that can help you. Um, well if you love teaching then it's great because you get to paid to make art and show other people how to make art, which is it totally a valid way of making money. Um, and if you're like, ah, whatever. Like it's also another way to make money while you're building up the other parts of your business as well.

Speaker 2: 34:13 Right. Okay. So I guess my next question would be then, um, how, like what is your final advice for anyone who's wanting to, to make the switch to be a full time artist and can you tell us a little bit about what you did? You know, maybe the second time around that was super successful and allowed you to, you know, become a full time artist and not have to go back to another full time job.

Speaker 3: 34:36 Yeah. Um, uh, creative community. Get involved with your creative community and whether that's online or in person or both? Ideally both. Um, it's incredibly important because especially people who are trying to do the same thing that you are, it's going to make a world of difference to be able to ask them like, oh, how are you doing this? Or what do you think? Is this my, I'm trying to do this way of getting clients. Is this a good idea? Do you think this is a good idea or do you have any advice or help for me and help them? You never know where those connections are going to lead to work down the road. Or like collaboration's where like you lift them up so that they get seen more and they lift you up and you get seen more. Um, they're going to understand your struggles. They're going to understand, they're going to be able to celebrate your wins all around. Like creative community is super, super, super, super important.

Speaker 2: 35:29 Awesome. So you would say that was the main difference between the first time you tried and then coming around the second time. Was that having that creative allowed you, um, or helped you, maybe gave you advice as well, you know, into becoming

Speaker 3: 35:43 honestly, yes, yes. Uh, well probably it was partly experience, like knowing a little bit more of what I was trying to do, but also like I, I was, I was, I was going back and forth with, um, like my, my, um, collective pencil parade and there was something about that accountability of like, okay, well we've got to do this marketing effort by this date. We've got to send out these postcards to these clients. And just like having that extra like, um, motivation and also like pressure, not to just let it slide and be like, it's okay, I don't have to do that thing. Right. That's interesting. That's really, really helped.

Speaker 2: 36:19 That's interesting that you send out postcards. Um, do you have a favorite social media platform for your marketing efforts? Uh, with Pencil parade or either just for yourself,

Speaker 3: 36:27 email, if it's, if it's with companies, email, email, email, email, email. Um, I love Instagram because it's fun and it's easy and I think it's a great second portfolio. You never know what art directors are looking at it, but I don't, I have never been found via my social media platforms. I think it's all come, not that people let, not that our directors don't look at them. It's not that it's not in, it's not insignificant. It is, um, important. But I think most companies that I've worked with have found me because I reached out to them. Um, hopefully as I, you know, like grow in my career that will switch and people will discover me. But right now that's, that's not what's happening for me. It's all email. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 37:12 Interesting. I love that. And they say that email marketing is definitely not dead, so it's, no, not at all. Yeah. All right, well I'm brook, where can everyone find you online and tell us a little bit more about your skill share class if people are wanting to take your skills, skillshare class and find out a little bit more about, um, how to make the switch to a full time artist.

Speaker 3: 37:35 And you can find me on skillshare. Um, I'm Brooke Glaser on there. You can just kind of search for me. There is a, I've got an intro to appropriate class that shows people how to use procreate. Um, the making a living as an artist class. Uh, it really does cover like a lot of stuff that we've talked about a little bit more in detail. Um, pricing, um, helping yourself, like figure out what your business strategy is. Um, and then you can also find me on Instagram and a, I'm paper playgrounds on Instagram because nobody seems to remember how to spell my name, either one of them correctly. If they get one right, they get the other wrong. Um, and I also have a mailing list, so I do, um, anytime that I come out with a new class or I'm doing a meetup or a workshop in like a specific city, I send that out in my emails. Um, and you can sign up for that, uh, on my website, which is BrookeGlaser.com. You can also find that by going to my Instagram and uh, there's always links to find things everywhere. I have a youtube channel too, but.

Speaker 2: 38:41 Awesome. Thank you. Oh, tell us about, tell us a little bit more about your youtube channel before we sign off on what kind of videos are you posting there?

Speaker 3: 38:49 Ah, nothing right now.

Speaker 2: 38:54 What are some of your most popular videos? Can you tell us that?

Speaker 3: 38:56 Um, so I, I do some uh, some blogs just about like my day to day, like life on it's uh, as an illustrator working freelance. And I do some like advice like how to set goals and that sort of thing. Awesome.

Speaker 2: 39:12 Well everyone, thank you so much for tuning in today. If you liked this video, please give it a thumbs up and make sure to subscribe to my channel. Hit the little bell so you get notifications every time we come out with a new video. And thanks so much. We'll see you in the next [inaudible]

Speaker 1: 39:28 say, thank you so much for listening to the design tribe of podcast. I hope you enjoyed the conversation today. Here comes the part where I need to ask you for a little favor. Help a sister out. Next time you're in iTunes, please leave a rating and a review. Seriously, please. Only things of few seconds and it was quite literally make my day for real. It helps this podcast get found so that other often people like you can join the dialog and connect with each other. And as a quick reminder, you can watch the video version of the most podcast episodes too. To get notifications. Head over to LaurenLesley.com/webinar-series and remember that Lesley is spelled with an e y or check out the design tribe Facebook group where I'll be streaming on Facebook live as well. Have a great day, a great attitude, and a great life.Talk Soon.

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