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The 21st century may be the Pacific Century, and China appears poised to become America’s greatest rival for global power and influence. Host Michael Auslin and guests discuss the latest politics, economics, security, and cultural news in China, Asia, and America.
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Law and the Future of War

Asia-Pacific Institute for Law and Security

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Through conversation with experts in technology, law and military affairs, this series explores how new military technology and international law interact. Edited and produced by Dr Lauren Sanders, the podcast is published by the Asia-Pacific Institute for Law and Security. Until July 2024, the podcast was published by the University of Queensland School of Law.
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In this episode we hear from Professor Dale Stephens on the long-awaited release of The Woomera Manual on the International Law of Military Space Operations, how it came about, what it is intended to do, and where international law might be headed in relation to military space operations - as well as the challenges in drafting an international law …
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In this episode we dive into issues of human-machine teaming, with human factors engineer Jan Maarten Schraagen. Having edited the recently released book, Responsible Use of AI in Military Systems, Jan Maarten is an expert on how brittle technologies influence joint cognitive system performance. In this episode, in addition to exploring the book, w…
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Part of the ongoing debate about the lawfulness of autonomy in military systems in the manner in which the technology integrates with and interacts with its human masters. The term Meaningful Human Control (or MHC) has garnered particular relevance in this debate. Today we speak with Dr Lena Trabucco about her upcoming OpinioJuris Symposium on Mili…
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In this episode, Lauren Sanders is speaking with fellow LFW researcher, Renato Wolf about the issue of determining where legal obligations lie in the conduct of attacks, carried out by AWS. In particular they delve into his research about the Art 57 term ‘those who plan or decide attacks’ to see how that maps onto AWS, how that features in the AWS …
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In this episode, Dr Lauren Sanders speaks with Professor Stuart Casey-Maslen about Directed Energy Weapons. They traverse the existing legal controls on these weapons, and speak about the potential for future regulation of novel uses of energy weapons in armed conflict. This conversation preceded a presentation by Dr Casey-Maslen, Dr Sanders and Dr…
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As part of our ‘futures’ mini-series, in this episode we are looking specifically at Algorithmic Futures, with hosts of the podcast of the same name: Dr Zena Assaad and Dr Elizabeth Williams, both from ANU. Today we are going to specifically focus on the breadth of the design and uncertainty problem for capabilities augmented by algorithms. Elizabe…
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Continuing our future of war series, this episode dives into the legal implications of increasing transparency of the battlespace as a result of technological change; and looks at developments in biological warfare that challenge the long-standing prohibition on biological weapons at international law. We speak with Rob Lawless from the Leiber Inst…
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In this third episode in our futures mini-series, we continue our scoping of the utility of seeking to predict the future of war; before deep diving into emerging and disruptive technologies. Recorded in late September 2023, we are speaking with Artur Gruszczak about the Future of War, and his recently edited Handbook on the same topic, released by…
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Recorded in early September 2023, this episode continues our futures mini-series, where we speak with Dr Ian Langford and Professor David Killcullen about the future of war in the Indo-Pacific region. In this episode we will be getting a download on what the change in geopolitics in the Indo-Pacific means for Australia, and how that might impact ch…
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In this episode, we conclude our interview with Dr Charles Adeogun-Phillips, discussing guilty pleas and their development in international criminal law. Dr Charles A. Adeogun-Phillips is an accomplished international lawyer and former lead international prosecutor. He founded the cross-border law firm of Charles Anthony LLP, following a distinguis…
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In this interview, we are speaking with Dr Charles Adeogun-Phillips about the history of guilty pleas in international criminal law, as an author of a chapter on the same topic, as part of the edited works, Contemporary International Criminal Law Issues - Contributions in Pursuit of Accountability for Africa and the World. The challenges associated…
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We continue this international criminal law mini-series by speaking with Natacha Bracq, who wrote a chapter on gender and sexual-based violence in Contemporary International Criminal Law Issues - Contributions in Pursuit of Accountability for Africa and the World, which deals with a range of issues impacting contemporary ICL practice in Africa and …
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We start our futures mini-series by speaking with an eminent military historian on the future of warfare. In this episode we are delighted to be joined by Sir Lawrence Freedman. Recorded in September 2023 he joins us to talk about the future of warfare, having regard to his approach to predicting future war, as outlined in The Future of War: A Hist…
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We start this international criminal law mini-series by speaking with Mr Takeh Sendze, who is the editor of a recently published book, Contemporary International Criminal Law Issues - Contributions in Pursuit of Accountability for Africa and the World, which deals with a range of issues impacting contemporary ICL practice in Africa and around the w…
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In this episode in the BarbieHeimer series, we focus on the history of the Manhattan Project and the accuracy of the Oppenheimer movie. We are speaking with nuclear historian Chris Griffith, about the history, and consequences of the atomic age. As a warning, if you haven’t seen the film we will be talking about the movie’s plot lines and breaking …
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In this 'BarbieHeimer' special episode, we return to the plastic doll, to talk about materialism, symbolism and the souvenirs in international law. Emily Crawford and Jacqueline Mowbray walk us through their Souvenirs in International Law exhibit and project; and where Barbie features in their exhibit, as well as introducing us to Doudou Louis, the…
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In the second in our 'BarbieHeimer' series, we turn to the Oppenheimer movie and speak with world-renowned nuclear disarmament advocate and expert, Gareth Evans, about the opportunity the movie missed in re-energising efforts to the nuclear disarmament cause. We speak with him about the need for Australia to return to its former position of influen…
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In this, the first of our Special Series on the BarbieHeimer phenomenon, we speak with international law of the sea expert, Professor Don Rothwell to find out what all the controversy was about in relation to the banning of the Barbie movie in Vietnam; the 9-Dash line; and the importance of maps in international law. Professor Donald R Rothwell is …
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Today we continue our ‘BarbieHeimer’ (or Barbenheimer) series, and are talking today about the meme itself. Is it appropriate to mash these two films together? Is this frivolity making light of the serious impacts of nuclear weapons and the need for a refocus on non-proliferation and disarmament efforts? We speak with a scholar of Visual Politics a…
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In this interview, we are continuing our series on legal review of AWS, and speaking with two of the Law and Future of war research team, about an issue that impacts the design approaches to AWS: the alignment problem. In May 2023, there were reports of an AWS being tested, that turned upon its operator, and eventually cut its communications links …
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In this episode, as part of our series on AWS, legal review & IHL, we speak with Netta Goussac & Laura Bruun about their recently released SIPRI report on IHL & AWS, asking questions about what IHL permits, prohibits & requires in the design, development & use of AWS. Netta Goussac is a Special Counsel with Lexbridge (a legal practice & consultancy…
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As part of our new, limited series on the Legal Review of AWS, we speak with two researchers from the Asser Institute on what the legal review obligation means for decision support systems, and what technical challenges exist in approaching the review obligation during the design and development phases in the creation of AWS. Taylor Kate Woodcock i…
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The discussion about AI regulation and law has been hampered by a lack of understanding about what AI actually is and what it can do. To date, there is no agreed definition of what constitutes AI; not any likely international consensus, with many states and NGOs adopting their own definitions. This problem is then compounded when it comes to defini…
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In this special episode, members of the Law and Future of War research project discuss two significant events occurring in the week of 17 March 2023 relating to criminal justice for alleged war crimes: 1. The ICC arrest warrant issued in respect of the situation in Ukraine, and President Vladimir Putin's role in the alleged deportation of children …
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In this episode, Dr Lauren Sanders speaks to Dr Paul Scharre, Vice President and Director of Studies at CNAS (the Centre for a New American Security), is a leading author on autonomous weapons and the impact of AI in the military. He has an extensive background in the drafting and implementation of policy relating to the current and future use of a…
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In today’s episode we are continuing our holiday season special on entertainment and IHL. Dr Lauren Sanders is speaking again with Professor Shiri Krebs, but this time about targeting and the movies. In particular they are talking about her paper, Drone-Cinema, Data Practices, and the Narrative of IHL, and how representations of the use of drones i…
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In this episode of our IHL and entertainment series, Dr Lauren Sanders speaks with Dr Shannon Zimmerman about Dr Who and his crimes of genocide. Talking about the examples of genocide by Dr Who throughout the series, this interview discussed Dr Zimmerman's paper, 'Doctor Who and the Responsibility to Protect: Public Perspectives of Atrocity Crimes'…
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Dr Lauren Sanders speaks to one of our regular contributors to the podcast, Professor Dale Stephens and combines two of his specialised areas of expertise: space law and international humanitarian law. How might this be possible you might ask? Well, as part of our special holiday series episodes, we are going to turn our minds to a long time ago in…
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In this episode of our special entertainment and the law series, Law and Future of War Senior Research Fellow, Dr Eve Massingham discusses the obligation to ensure respect with IHL with her colleague Dr Lauren Sanders. Eve talks about her recent papers detailing how governments should wield their influence over the entertainment industry for good: …
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This is the first episode in our special series on entertainment and the law of war. In this episode, Dr Sebastian Kaempf, a Senior Lecturer in Peace and Conflict Studies, joins Dr Lauren Sanders to discuss. his documentary: and the documents he's uncovered from the US CIA and military Entertainment Liaison Offices as part of this project. Dr Sebas…
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In this final episode of our series on accountability in Ukraine, Dr Lauren Sanders speaks with Associate Professor Danielle Ireland-Piper and Dr Melinda Rankin about universal jurisdiction and how it may play a part in the prosecution of war crimes occurring in the Ukraine conflict. Danielle is an Associate Professor at the ANU National Security C…
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This is the fourth episode in our series about accountability in Ukraine. This episode focuses on the collection and collation of information (and potential evidence) using open-source intelligence. As you will hear, OSINT has played a key role in the development of the Russian invasion of Ukraine and in the monitoring of conflict in Myanmar. Today…
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This episode is the third in a series of podcasts analysing accountability in the current Ukrainian conflict. In this third episode, we are speaking with Dr Carrie McDougall, from the University of Melbourne, who has been heavily involved in the proposal for the establishment of a Special International Tribunal to facilitate the investigation and p…
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Hoover Institution fellow Michael Auslin is joined by eminent strategist Sir Lawrence Freedman to talk about whether Putin will use nuclear weapons in Ukraine, how China is expanding its nuclear arsenal, the relationship between political and military leadership, and Freedman’s favorite nuclear-themed movie.…
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This episode is the second instalment in a series of podcasts analysing accountability in the current Ukrainian conflict. In this episode we are talking to Rebecca Barber, an expert in the United Nations General Assembly (UNGA) powers and humanitarian action, to discuss the power of the UNGA and its role in providing accountability for actors in th…
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This episode starts a series of podcasts analysing accountability in the current Ukrainian conflict. In this first episode, we are joined by Ana Filipa Vrodljak, the UNESCO Chair on International Law and Cultural Heritage, and Professor of Law at UTS, and Mayee Warren – a senior practitioner in the management of international criminal trials - to t…
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On 25 Aug 2022, the US Department of Defense released its Civilian Harm and Mitigation Response Plan, which has been created, in part as a result of the public scrutiny on civilian casualty incidents following the Iraq campaign. In this episode, Dr Lauren Sanders speaks with Marc Garlasco, who has been intimately involved with this issue, having be…
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