In this episode, Lola interviews ordained priest and writer Shannon Kearns. Shannon TL Kearns is a transgender man who believes in the transformative power of story. As an ordained priest, a playwright, a theologian, and a writer all of his work revolves around making meaning through story. He's the co-founder of QueerTheology.com and his first boo…

This Quoircast podcast episode is brought to you by The Wild Olive Podcast. Check them out! This episode is also brought to you by Peaceful Warrior Coffee Company where they perfectly roast their single-origin beans on the same day they ship to you and shipping is always free. Jason recommends trying the Gourmet Breakfast Blend! In this episode, th…

This Quoircast podcast episode is brought to you by the book, Drugs and Jesus, by Joshua Lawson which is available now! This episode is also brought to you by Peaceful Warrior Coffee Company where they perfectly roast their single-origin beans on the same day they ship to you and shipping is always free. Jason recommends trying the Tanzania! In thi…

In this introductory episode of his brand-new podcast, Jason Elam discusses the need for a wholesale re-evaluation of our parenting methods in light of spiritual deconstruction. You can purchase a copy of the book, Parenting Deconstructed: Navigating Your Spiritual Evolution Without Leaving Your Family Behind, here. Please follow Parenting Deconstr…

This Quoircast podcast episode is brought to you by The Story of Christianity Told As Good News for All by Ric Machuga which is available now! This episode is also brought to you by Peaceful Warrior Coffee Company where they perfectly roast their single-origin beans on the same day they ship to you and shipping is always free. In this episode, the …

Hey, everyone. Jason here again. I got so much great feedback from the "Jesus the Mystic" message that I did a couple of weeks ago, that I decided to turn it into a series. Here is the second installment, "Are You Ready to Get Unstuck?". Sometimes, the way out of our rut is simpler than we think. What is your next step to getting unstuck? We'd love…

This Quoircast podcast episode if brought to you by Keith Giles' latest book, Sola Mysterium: Celebrating the Beautiful Uncertainty of Everything. Order your copy of this groundbreaking book today! This episode is also brought to you by Peaceful Warrior Coffee Co. Use promo code "Messy" for 20% off of your first order! In this conversation, Lola, K…

This Quoircast podcast episode is brought to you by the book "What Can't Be Hidden" by Brandon Andess. Order your copy today here. In this new episode, Lola, Kyle, and Jason welcome Quoir Publishers and authors Matthew J. Distefano and Keith Giles for a conversation about censorship and its' high cost for society. Books you are going to want to che…

Hey, everyone! Jason here. I was in the car for 10 hours yesterday and had bursts of conversation with God. I took some notes to share with you. This one is a little out there and might stretch some of my evangelical friends. Please stick with me. I think you'll like where we end up. In this talk, I discuss: The need to separate Jesus the first-cen…

In this brand-new episode, Jason speaks with author Heather Hamilton about her spiritual journey, mystical experiences that change our lives, and her brilliant new book, Returning to Eden. Heather Hamilton received her B.A. in Journalism from Georgia State University and spent many years doing video production before discovering her love of writing…

This Quoircast podcast episode is brought to you by the This is Not Church podcast featuring our friends Jon and Nat Turney. If you're not listening to them already you should definitely check them out! In this episode of Messy Spirituality, Jason interviews author and former pastor Kevin Sweeney about his spiritual journey and the hidden power of …

This Quoircast podcast episode is brought to you by the Heretic Happy Hour podcast. If you're not listening to the granddaddy of all destruction podcasts you definitely ought to check them out! In this episode of Messy Spirituality, Lola interviews Canadian born artist, Bri Shaw, about her life and work. You're going to love this conversation! You …

This episode is sponsored by the incredible book Divine Echoes by Dr. Mark Gregory Harris. If you haven't already read this book you're missing out! In today's episode, Jason speaks with Brent Schebler of Ink Drinker Editing and Literary Services about his spiritual journey and some of his favorite reads of 2022. Books mentioned in this episode: Th…

This QuoirCast podcast episode is brought to you by our friends at the Heretic Happy Hour podcast! Check them out wherever you listen to podcasts! On this episode, Jason interviews returning guest Brad Jersak to discuss reframing the conversation about deconstruction and its impact. Brad Jersak is an author and teacher based in Abbotsford, BC. He c…

This QuoirCast podcast episode is brought to you by the Ideas Digest podcast from two Aussie blokes-Konrad and Matt. Check them out! On this episode Lola, Kyle, and Jason discuss our current understandings/beliefs about angels, demons, and the spirit realm. Auntie Lola also has an all new WTF Bible Story that you're gonna love. During our interview…

This QuoirCast podcast episode is brought to you by the Ideas Digest podcast from two Aussie blokes-Konrad and Matt. Check them out! On this episode Lola, Kyle, and Jason discuss what makes each of them grateful. Auntie Lola also has an all new WTF Bible Story that will make all the ladies very grateful. During our interview segment, Jason intervie…

This QuoirCast podcast episode is brought to you by This is Not Church podcast featuring our good friends Jon and Nat Turney. Check them out! On this episode Lola, Kyle, and Jason discuss what each of them think might happen after we die. Auntie Lola also has a very spooky Halloween edition of WTF Bible Stories. During our interview segment, Jason …

This QuoirCast podcast episode is brought to you by This is Not Church podcast featuring our good friends Jon and Nat Turney. They drop new episodes every Monday and their latest episode features none other than our own Lola Robbins! This brand new episode features: A big announcement worthy of celebration! A special Halloween edition of "Auntie Lo…

This QuoirCast podcast episode is brought to you by This is Not Church podcast featuring our good friends Jon and Nat Turney. They drop new episodes every Monday so check them out! In this new episode, Lola, Kyle, and Jason discuss ballot initiatives in several states that seek to end forced labor in U.S. prisons and lingering racial injustice in t…

In this conversation, Lola, Kyle, and Jason discuss the news regarding Matt Chandler, lead pastor of The Village Church in Flower Mound, TX who recently stepped down due to what he referred to as "non-sexual, non-romantic, unwise course joking" with a female via direct messages. We look at how the situation was handled and the questions raised by t…

In this new episode, Lola, Kyle and Jason discuss one of the most disgusting stories in the Bible and take a look at rampant financial exploitation and manipulation in the church. Join the conversation on our Messy Conversations Facebook group. Please take a minute to like our Facebook page and follow/friend all of our hosts on social media! You ca…

In this new episode, Lola, Kyle and Jason discuss performance art at CPAC, the injustice of mass incarceration, another twisted Bible story, and the negative impact of religions based on fear. Take a minute to like our Facebook page and follow/friend all of our hosts on social media! You can find Lola on Facebook, Instagram, and TikTok You can find…

In this new uncut conversation, Jason Elam discusses finding life and community outside of church with authors Laura and Karl Forehand. Karl Forehand is the award-winning author of Apparent Faith, The Tea Shop, Being, and The Hotel. Laura Forehand is an educator specializing in whole brain teaching. Laura and Karl are the authors of the new book, O…

In this Messy Conversations interview, Lola speaks with Andrew Pledger about life, God, and his unconventional spiritual journey. Andrew Pledger is a religious trauma survivor who escaped fundamentalist Christianity (the IFB cult). He brings awareness to spiritual and religious abuse. Andrew's podcast Speaking Up with Andrew Pledger offers a platfo…

In this episode Lola, Kyle, and Jason discuss the question "Could Church Be Harming Our Kids?", the recent video of Uvalde police officers, and rethinking whether or not David was really a "man after God's own heart". Take a minute to like our Facebook page and follow/friend all of our hosts on social media! You can find Lola on Facebook, Instagram…

Welcome to Season 4 of the show! We're excited to welcome Kyle Butler and Lola Robbins as our new co-hosts and we're launching a new format that we hope you will love! In this first episode of the new era, we discuss new beginnings, the story of Esther in the Bible, the US Supreme Court decision regarding Roe vs. Wade, and learning to hear the lang…

In this brand new episode, Keith Giles signals the biggest shift in his thinking of his writing career. Keith is going "full heretic" by embracing the mystery of God and rejecting religious certainty much to the dismay of a few of his former supporters. Keith's latest book is Sola Mysterium: Celebrating the Beautiful Uncertainty of Everything (Quio…

In this new episode, co-host Ashley Robbins takes over the show for her first solo interview! She has a conversation with Erin Camille who grew up in a pastor's home and saw the worst of ministry life up close. You can connect with Erin on Facebook. Please subscribe, rate, and review this podcast on your platform of choice. The Messy Spirituality P…

In this episode, I speak with one of my favorite authors, speakers, and thinkers-Brian McLaren. Brian D. McLaren is an author, speaker, activist, and public theologian. A former college English teacher and pastor, he is a passionate advocate for “a new kind of Christianity” – just, generous, and working with people of all faiths for the common good…

In this episode, Co-host, Ashley Robbins, and I talk to Macey Berry about her experience growing up in purity culture and the devastating impact it had on her life. You can connect with Macey on Facebook. Macey mentions the Your Favorite Heretics Facebook group during this conversation. This group was started by our friends, Derek and Rachel Myers.…

In this episode, I'm joined by my friend James Early. James is a Bible teacher, speaker, blogger, and podcaster. He grew up in Amarillo, TX, and received his BA from Vanderbilt University. He gives talks and conducts workshops on the Bible covering a wide range of topics to churches and groups as well as online. Since October 2008, James has conduc…

My good friend, Karl Forehand, had a stroke in January 2022. A month later, he and his wife, Laura, joined me for a conversation about the stroke, Karl's recovery, ongoing therapy, hopes for the future, and Karl's first ever fiction book which is releasing March 22, 2022. If you are able, please help Karl and Laura as they navigate this difficult s…

I'm joined on this episode by two of our favorite apostates, Matthew J. Distefano and Keith Giles. We discuss the recent criticism of deconstruction by many within evangelicalism. Are any of their criticisms fair? How should we respond when we feel unfairly attacked? Matthew J. Distefano is an author, podcaster, and Patheos columnist. His latest bo…

In this episode co-hosted by Ashley Robbins, we discuss the hurt caused by toxic church institutions and a possible way forward taking the best of church community but leaving behind the many destructive aspects that have wounded so many. Ashley Robbins is an ex evangelical trying her best to honor real gospel. She is a purity culture insurgent. Sh…

In this conversation, we speak with activist and former pastor Joshua Lawson about his compelling work with people who struggle with substance use disorder. We dive into the roots of addiction, the hidden cost of the "war on drugs" and how each of us can make a difference in this fight. Joshua's excellent book, The Face of Addiction, is available h…

We're kicking off season three today with a special introduction by our friend, Ashley Robbins! My guest this week is prolific author and podcaster, Keith Giles! In this conversation, we discuss our cultural addiction to violence and what we can do to break the cycle of violence in our context. Keith's latest book is Jesus Unarmed: How the Prince o…

In this conversation, I talk to my friend, Todd Vick, about his continuing spiritual journey and how we set about reconstructing our mind after deconstruction. Todd Vick is an author, podcaster, and former pastor. His latest book is entitled "The Reconstructing of Your Mind" and it was published by Quoir. You can connect with Todd on Facebook, Twit…

Recently, I had a beautiful and life giving conversation with my friend, Joe Machuta. In this conversation, we discuss Joe’s eclectic spiritual journey as well as his stubborn love for Jesus. It really is worth an hour of your time and I sincerely hope you will check it out! I know that this conversation will stretch many of us theologically, but t…

In this brand new episode, I talk to my good friends, Jon and Nat Turney, about God, church, spiritual evolution, and their new podcast, This is Not Church. This is a fun conversation that I think you're really going to enjoy so be sure to check it out. Don't miss Jon and Nat's podcast, This is Not Church. You can follow Jon and Nat and their podca…

We're back! I really missed podcasting so my retirement was short-lived. In this brand new episode, we talk to author Karl Forehand about making the transition from "doing" to "being" and from "reacting" to "responding". I'll be joining the conversation over on Karl and Laura's podcast, The Desert Sanctuary, on a monthly basis starting this month. …

In this brief uncut message, Jason talks about the myth of safety and how to look for signs of health in our relationships and communities. Books referenced in this episode: "Being: A Journey Toward Presence and Authenticity" by Karl Forehand "Before You Lose Your Mind: Deconstructing Bad Theology in the Church" edited by Keith Giles Check out the …

In this finale episode, I ask bestselling author Keith Giles some of the questions that I've heard most often from folks who are deconstructing. Why did Jesus have to die? What happened on the cross? What do I do with the resurrection? Where did this monster version of God come from? What does it mean to be born again? And many other questions. Nea…

In this episode, we speak with author Anita Grace Brown about how her practice of yoga has deepened her connection with Jesus and the world around her. Anita helps prepare hearts and minds for a loving relationship with Mother/Father/God/Creator by facilitating practices like yoga, prayerful meditation, and chants. Her strength in moving toward hum…

In this episode, I talk to two of my favorite voices on social media, Derek and Rachel Myers from "Your Favorite Heretics". We have an open and heartfelt conversation about walking away from toxic faith and finding healing. To engage more with Rachel, Derek, and their work, you can follow Your Favorite Heretics on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and …

We kick off season two with a beautiful conversation with author, speaker, and podcaster Jonathan Puddle. Jonathan Puddle is an award-winning writer, speaker, husband and father who hosts the popular interview show, The Puddcast. Having traveled the world and lived in many nations, Jonathan teaches from a culturally rich & spiritually inclusive fra…

My guest for this "Messy Conversations" BONUS episode is Matthew J. Distefano. Matthew is a brilliant writer, theologian, musician, podcaster, social worker, and Patheos contributor. He is one of four co-hosts of the insanely popular Heretic Happy Hour podcast and also hosts a solo podcast called "Apostates Anonymous". He is the author of the Amazo…

In this episode, we welcome our good friends, Karl and Laura Forehand, as we explore practical ways to keep our peace in chaotic times. This conversation was real and raw and I think you'll really enjoy it. Laura Forehand is an educator, author, podcaster, mom, grandmother, and so much more. Her podcast is "The Whole Brain Teaching Podcast".Karl Fo…

In this heartfelt and moving conversation, author Keith Giles and I discuss his transition from holding a view of eternal conscious torment (burning forever in hell) to annihilationism and then to his current view of patristic universalism. We also discuss common objections to ultimate redemption. Keith is one of four co-hosts of the insanely popul…

Welcome to the season one finale of The Messy Spirituality Podcast: "Exiles on Main Street" featuring Brian Zahnd. Brian serves as Pastor of Word of Life Church in St. Joseph, Missouri. He is also the author of several incredible books such as: "Water to Wine", "Beauty Will Save the World", "Farewell to Mars", "Sinners in the Hands of a Loving God"…

Episode 58 of the podcast features part two of our interview with our most requested guest ever, Dr. C. Baxter Kruger! Baxter is a theologian, writer [and fishing lure designer] and the Director of Perichoresis Ministries. He is a native of Prentiss, Mississippi. He and his wife Beth have been married for 30 years and have four children. A life lon…