December Talent Report with Jim Morgan

Talent Report+THRIVE

Description: 🎧 In this December Talent Report, we're spotlighting the freshest trends in the realm of talent. Uncover cutting-edge recruitment tactics, explore the surge in demand for emerging skills, and stay informed about the latest developments throughout the month of December. Tune in to stay one step ahead in the dynamic landscape of the competitive job market! 🌟

Resources:

Talent Report+ Webinar Series

MRA Membership

About MRA

Let's Connect:

Guest Bio - Jim Morgan

Guest LinkedIn Profile - Jim Morgan

Host Bio - Sophie Boler

Host LinkedIn Profile - Sophie Boler

Transcript:

Transcripts are computer generated -- not 100% accurate word-for-word.

00:00:03:24 - 00:00:25:03
Unknown
Hello everybody and welcome to 30 minute Thrive, your go to podcast for anything and everything HR, powered by MRA, the Management Association. Looking to stay on top of the ever changing world of HR? MRA has got you covered. We'll be the first to tell you what's hot and what's not. I'm your host, Sophie Boler and we are so glad you're here.

00:00:25:04 - 00:00:45:07
Unknown
Now it's time to thrive. Hello, everybody, and welcome to this episode of 30 Minute THRIVE. It is time to go over this month's talent report, which is an up to the minute review of what's going on in the world of business with an emphasis on talent. With Jim Morgan, MRA's vice president of Workforce Strategies. So thanks for being here, Jim.

00:00:45:09 - 00:01:09:00
Unknown
Yeah, thanks for having me. Happy holidays. Happy holidays. Well, this month you are looking at 2024, actually the year ahead. So talking about the opportunities that await and some of the challenges that might be on the horizon as companies prepare for this next year, 2024. So starting out with recruiting and retention innovation, Jim, you pulled some stats from MRA's recent comp trends report.

00:01:09:02 - 00:01:32:24
Unknown
What is really shown here? Well, what we were talking about from the comp trends report was basically miscellaneous perks. Where are companies trying to distinguish themselves for others? Where are they trying to stand out? Just try to get some creative ideas of what people might be up to. And chuckled during the talent report that the number one item is employee lunches.

00:01:33:01 - 00:01:56:05
Unknown
And any time I'm meeting with HR people, I always say food. You know, it doesn't make any difference how, where or when, why food is always a winner. But food also brings with it the side effects of chance for people to talk to each other and get to know each other better and help with the culture. But it's always something that you know, was relatively simple and is appreciated by people.

00:01:56:07 - 00:02:33:07
Unknown
But on a more serious side of things, tuition assistance and flexible scheduling were numbers two and three, with about 65% of the companies saying that and the tuition assistance. Two things I think are happening. We talked a little bit about it last month, I think. But companies are starting to include tuition reimbursement in there. And so those students that might have student loans as becoming a part of that and I think you've got more both younger and seasoned workers that are looking for the specific training, which may be in an educational institution of what are the skills I'm missing.

00:02:33:07 - 00:02:57:07
Unknown
So if we say to you, boy, you know, Sophie, you're an up and comer, emerging leader, but we need you to work on these two things. Maybe you should go get a certificate in this and go take a class in that as people are trying to build those career paths, I think it's starting to be singled out a little bit more that let's just identify what this person maybe is lacking right now and give them the opportunity to grow there.

00:02:57:09 - 00:03:17:05
Unknown
Then we have some other things for allowance, additional time off office technology, enhanced benefit packages. And all of this comes back to what we're seeing more and more and is added the better that I know my employees and the people who work for me, the better I can figure out what matters to them. And we use the word benefits.

00:03:17:07 - 00:03:38:16
Unknown
But I mean, it could be simple as knowing, you know, you like a triple latte shot of peppermint, soy milk, something or other drink whole class. Okay, good. And that just black coffee or not tea. And so I come to you with a 12 pack of coke. I bring you I shop at Starbucks and get you the fancy drink that you like.

00:03:38:16 - 00:03:59:11
Unknown
You know, the benefit there is really, boy, he's paying attention and he cares about what's going on. So I think a lot of companies are just trying to figure out who are people. And one of the little things we can do besides offering a401k in health care and time off, that might make a difference to them. So that I think is really becoming a bigger part of the retention strategy.

00:03:59:13 - 00:04:25:02
Unknown
Yeah, absolutely. Kind of going off of that recruiting and retention and moving into talent thinking, you highlighted succession planning in that it's really top of mind for companies. But before we dive into that, let's look at your quote of the month, which talks about succession planning. So why did you exactly pick this quote and you? Well, first you got to tell us what to call it.

00:04:25:04 - 00:04:48:03
Unknown
The one that I picked was on John Maxwell. And he's a he's an author and speaker. And the quote was, when all is said and done, your ability as a leader will be judged by how well your people and your organization did after you were gone. Your lasting value will be measured by succession. And I picked that one because of what we're going to talk about here in a second is succession planning is becoming a bigger deal.

00:04:48:03 - 00:05:22:19
Unknown
We've talked about that not only for the C-suite but for all of the key positions. Companies are trying to build a deeper bench, have a number two person. So whenever somebody leaves, we've got someone in the pipeline. We're not starting over every time, just good business decisions. But then we talked with the CEOs about it all of those things still apply, but they're looking at it almost holistically from a strategy point of view that says, well, if you take those things I just said, that adds stability to the organization, we all get thrown into turmoil when someone goes.

00:05:22:21 - 00:05:46:21
Unknown
That type of transparency puts our employees at ease. That they know. All right. Well, whether I like the person or don't like the person, it's the enemy I know versus the enemy. I don't know. And I'd like to know what's what's happening there. It certainly reduces costs. So we have to find someone. I would much rather have to find the number three position because number two, field number one.

00:05:46:21 - 00:06:10:10
Unknown
Number three, cell number two. And now I'm looking for the third person down the system rather than the top of it. And so if we built that, that's just better for that for the organization. And it's a chance for us to show value to employees. If, you know, if someone sits down with you and say, you know, Sophia in the marketing department, here's what our plans are for the department, Here's where we think you fill in, here's where we think you fit in.

00:06:10:12 - 00:06:35:06
Unknown
It gives you something to say, okay, I know what what they're thinking about for me. Then I can have discussions on maybe that's not where I want it to go, or that is where I want to go. But just organizationally, that succession planning makes a big difference. I think what that quote really points out is, you know, we can have an influence while we're here, but probably the biggest influence we can have is do we set the place up for success after we're done?

00:06:35:08 - 00:07:01:11
Unknown
And so the process that we put in place, the things that we do, are not people dependent. It's not over. When Jim leaves, all of this stops. It's Jim built this and so it's all going to continue and nobody else has to figure it out. And I think that's that's really the type of succession planning there they're looking for is how do we make this systemic so we don't have to go through this big deal every time somebody might retire or go somewhere else.

00:07:01:13 - 00:07:22:02
Unknown
Yeah, absolutely. And I guess you you kind of touched on it, but is there anything anything else that you wanted to add was talent thinking and succession planning in terms of why we're kind of touching on this now and any other information? Yeah, that's that's a good follow up. You know, I think we're touching on it now because of all these demographic things that we've been talking about.

00:07:22:04 - 00:07:49:21
Unknown
You know, we have 10,000 people turning 65 every day. That means a lot of folks are leaving the workplace more than ever before just because of the size of the baby boomers. So the numbers are driving it. And then just some of the generational things that we have in place. We're just building the list right now of what's different between the Z's and the Xers versus the Boomers in the Xs versus Z’s and the Millennials.

00:07:49:23 - 00:08:12:05
Unknown
And it's it's a pretty big gap in the succession. Planning helps the younger people coming up, you know, understand better what the older folks have done and how they've done it, maybe what's good and what's bad and helps the older folks figure out how are we going to transfer this knowledge down to a group that maybe thinks differently, learns differently.

00:08:12:07 - 00:08:33:01
Unknown
There's just lots of things that have to also be overcome because that's kind of a negative. But there's there's a ton of opportunities if we can figure out how to speak the same language. And I was in a you know, I was in a webinar today on Artificial Intelligence, actually, and the woman that was presenting it and this was just another difference that made me think about it.

00:08:33:03 - 00:08:54:09
Unknown
She said, You know, these younger two generations have grown up with this growth mentality that you shoot for the moon. If you make a mistake, you fail fast and then you pivot and you go in a different direction. And that's just because the world moves so fast. Now, that's what they grow up with. I grew up with let's have a solid process in place.

00:08:54:09 - 00:09:21:04
Unknown
Let's make sure it's controlled. We don't release anything until it's 100% perfect, you know, it's not ready. Fire, aim. It's always ready and fire. And so just the way we approach things is so incredibly different because of what we've seen that I think that's what's causing companies to try to plan out a little bit more because we're going to have we got to transfer all this knowledge and there might be a couple of gaps in there that we've got to figure out how to fill in for sure.

00:09:21:04 - 00:09:45:18
Unknown
And I would just add on and encourage listeners, if you do want to learn more about succession planning and some new tips and advice, we just did a podcast episode with our mogul Meyer in our Ohio office actually on succession planning solely. So she gives a lot of great advice and some resources too, on just how to get started and challenges to overcome.

00:09:45:18 - 00:10:09:15
Unknown
And kind of, Jim, like you mentioned, involving the whole organization, that's a good call out too, because I mean, in our organizational development area, there's just so much going on around strategic planning, strategic talent planning, succession planning. The people side of a lot of things is really getting a lot of attention. Absolutely. Well, moving on here, let's talk about some HR creativity.

00:10:09:15 - 00:10:35:18
Unknown
If so, you bring up AI in this section and the stats on companies stances on it. So what are you really seeing here? We had a report by an organization called Better Works, and it's how the workforce is responding to generative A.I. challenges and opportunities. That's mostly the work around Chat GPT and some of the other systems like that out there, trying to get a feel for where folks at right now.

00:10:35:18 - 00:11:01:12
Unknown
And with a little over 40% of the companies have made evaluating the use of generative AI for HR a top priority. Now what does that mean? I don't know. But at least it means that a lot of companies are starting to think about it. Another 20% are interested in starting to ask questions. 20% more said, Well, you know, people are talking about it in the hallway, but we're not really doing anything.

00:11:01:14 - 00:11:37:16
Unknown
But less than 10% really said we don't want anybody touching the thing, you know. So I think like it or don't like it, it's coming. You know, it's not coming here. And so I think companies are starting to understand that. And if you go a step further, the survey also said, you know, if you talk to your company, to your employees and how they're using it, you know, and they're like, yeah, about two thirds of them are using some of their strategic work, 60% generating ideas, 52% for simple writing, you know, So there might even be a little bit of a dichotomy here between where the company might think it is and where its employees

00:11:37:16 - 00:11:58:22
Unknown
might be, because nobody's asking questions yet, you know, and that I mean, at MRA, you know, we put out part of the survey that said, are you doing anything? Let's let's find out who are dabblers are because, one, you want to encourage the innovation, but two, you want to make sure that people are getting into places where maybe they don't have the knowledge yet to do it.

00:11:58:22 - 00:12:20:08
Unknown
So I think as an employer, we really we've got to move and stay ahead of our own people to say, here's the culture, here's what we're thinking. You know, here are some do's and don'ts here, the user guide. And that's what we're working on right now at MIRA. And for our members, we're going to release the results of our artificial intelligence survey we just did with our members.

00:12:20:08 - 00:12:47:11
Unknown
And one of the questions we said was, what do you want from us? You know, over 80% said, I'd like our users policy. I would like do's and don'ts. I'd like to know, you know, basic information. And so we're working on that and we'll get that out to our members because I think they know their you know, whether they're doing it on their own or doing it for work or whatever it might be, it's happening out there and they've got to figure out what to do.

00:12:47:13 - 00:13:27:01
Unknown
And the last part of the report and again, this is by an organization called Better Works, they asked what specific areas are their employees hopeful about that could support bias removal? And the participants said, well, we think if you remove bias in employee training and development, performance evaluations and promotions, employee feedback, those three were all over 50%. You know, so people's initial reaction is, you know, if we're all on the employee feedback, if we're providing feedback to the organization but it's going in, we're not to a human, but in via artificial intelligence, one, it's anonymous.

00:13:27:02 - 00:13:52:10
Unknown
Nobody knows what happens. And then it removes the human from saying, Well, I know what that person's trying to say there, and that's not really true. So we're going to drop that one out. If it's going in through artificial intelligence. I mean, they'll read what was written and try to figure out exactly what that means. So people are at least open to it, probably more so than what I thought they were crucial in the pudding.

00:13:52:10 - 00:14:07:24
Unknown
When you start doing it there, people are going to be like, wait a minute, it all sounded really good, but I just want to make sure I can sit down and talk to Sophie through I'm talking to Sophie. I know what's going on versus, you know, feeding it in and different in different places. So it's new territory, it's new ground.

00:14:07:24 - 00:14:27:09
Unknown
People are trying to figure it out. And one of the other interesting things I heard just this morning is they were talking about if you talk to people initially and say, well, it could be evaluated by a human or an algorithm or an or an algorithm, people will pick the algorithm and they say, well, you know, if it's an algorithm and, you know, it must be true and honest.

00:14:27:11 - 00:14:46:24
Unknown
But the more people have the opportunity to question, well, what's in the algorithm, the less confidence they have that maybe that's what they want it to do. So it's almost like algorithm that sounds important, you know, but people are still writing the algorithm. So I start asking you questions about, well, how did you measure for this? Well, we took this, this and this.

00:14:47:01 - 00:15:08:04
Unknown
well, that's not what I would have taken. And then people are like, boy, you know what just happened? So new stuff that's always new stuff without a lot of guardrails. So people, I think, are really just they're feeling their way through it right now. Yeah, that's all so interesting. And I think there's so many functionalities like with AI and chat TV too.

00:15:08:04 - 00:15:26:12
Unknown
And I was just talking with a coworker and he, I don't know, he taught me so, so many new things that I didn't learn about chat that I thought, I get the gist of it and stuff, but it's like, my gosh, no, there's a whole other 50% that I didn't think are going to keep figuring that out each week.

00:15:26:18 - 00:15:49:08
Unknown
Yep. And this was, this was the discussion of the AI this morning was the growth mentality. This person has spent a lot of time out in the Silicon Valley and working for Google and other kind of companies. And the mindset out there is just we're going to release it. It may not be perfect and we're not even sure what's going to happen, but we're going to put it out there, which is basically what happened with the generative AI.

00:15:49:10 - 00:16:10:23
Unknown
And then we're going to pivot and we're going to go in different directions and, you know, that sort of has freaked people out like, my gosh, how can you do this without making sure you had it right? And their philosophy is we wouldn't have a 10th of the stuff that we have on our cell phones if somebody had just said, well, let's just try this and see what happens, you know, and then they try it.

00:16:10:23 - 00:16:29:05
Unknown
And if it works, great, and if it doesn't, they keep trying to fix it. And that's kind of where we are with all of this. And that was kind of difficult. Let's figure out how to do it differently. So it's it's a new world order, that's for sure. Yeah, absolutely. Well, how about what C-suite leaders are thinking about right now?

00:16:29:05 - 00:16:53:17
Unknown
Where do their concerns and thoughts really lie heading into 2024? Well, the artificial intelligence rears its ugly head again. But I think as people are starting to learn more and more about artificial intelligence, they're really starting to understand that any data analytics or any analysis that's done is based on the data. And if your data isn't any good, it's not going to make any difference.

00:16:53:19 - 00:17:22:02
Unknown
And I think for not the first time, because people have always wanted to have quality data and data integrity, but now that they see the next level coming, they're thinking, well, we're not even going to be able to do this. If the data that we have is mush. We can't run good analytics, we can't utilize artificial intelligence. So I think, you know, they're taking a step back here and saying, you know, we've been talking about all this stuff, but who truly is in charge of our data integrity?

00:17:22:02 - 00:17:46:09
Unknown
Who's truly in charge of collecting it, making sure that it's in there? What is the status of it? And I think that's what's starting to kind of keep people up. Now is to say we're we're living in a data analytics world with artificial intelligence about to take it to a whole new level. If what we have is not very good, then right now is the time for us to make sure we start filling in all the blanks for sure.

00:17:46:12 - 00:18:08:07
Unknown
Moving on here from the field, looks like you pulled some stats from a new survey from the Conference Board on U.S. Workers and Compensation in September of 2023. So you kind of summarized the data here and what you're seeing here. Yeah, this was from the Conference Board and it was trying to look at Non-salary compensation and say, you know what matters here?

00:18:08:12 - 00:18:32:00
Unknown
And I don't think there's any real surprises, but top of the list, workplace flexibility and options, whether by location, by hours, whatever, everybody's hearing it. But I think, you know, it's good to check in every once in a while and just say, is that still what's remaining at the top of the list? And it is right behind that was bonus and commissions and incentive pay.

00:18:32:02 - 00:19:00:04
Unknown
So not just your base salary, but it means something to people if they know they're going to be rewarded for certain achievements, certain revenue numbers or whatever. So 64% of the employees said that, 60% said generous paid time off. And I'm not sure what the definition of generous is, but it's a competitive market. So I'm guessing part of that is based in are you giving me enough that I can do the work life balance that I want?

00:19:00:06 - 00:19:24:24
Unknown
And is that a potential reward? Is that one of the things that we're giving away for a project well done for going the extra step or whatever, it may not be money for some people it might be take another day or something along those lines. Forth was retirement plans at just under 60%. And last but still over 50% in fifth place with health care plans that are flexible and affordable.

00:19:25:01 - 00:19:46:04
Unknown
So, you know, we got done talking about alternative benefits a little bit ago as people are trying to figure out other things out. But when you ask the question, what is it, you know, you still get paid time off retirement, health care, you know, the biggies are still the biggies. And so it's how do we make sure we're hitting the right parts of the biggies, I think.

00:19:46:04 - 00:20:04:18
Unknown
And then finding the creative one again, it comes back to knowing your people what what, what's a value to them. Because if I give days off to people who don't even use their time off, now they're looking at me like, what are you nuts? You know? And so no value add there. So what is it that they're looking for?

00:20:04:20 - 00:20:29:19
Unknown
Right? So you also had just seen vice president of commercial banking at BMO join you for this webinar and he gave insight into reviewing 2023 and then looking ahead into 2024 from an economic and financial standpoint. So what were some of of his key points? I'll I'll summarize them here, but I will say that Jeff really did a good job.

00:20:29:19 - 00:20:58:07
Unknown
And so if anybody wants to actually see the recording with his charts and things, they should, you know, go to our Web site at Marinette Dawg and look up the talent report for our December. But his outlook was actually pretty positive. He said. At this point, most economists are predicting that stocks are going to have a pretty positive year in 2020 for some of the terms and quotes he used was slow but controlled growth.

00:20:58:07 - 00:21:27:16
Unknown
And the hard part is over, which I think right now people would take as great optimism if you could just give me, you know, just give me something relatively stable and put the probability of a recession in 2024 between 15 and 25%. So that's pretty optimistic that, you know, we're not going to see something in 2024. You know, good news, bad news in the United States, the economic conditions are pretty good.

00:21:27:18 - 00:21:53:18
Unknown
There's a lot of geopolitical noise out there around the rest of the world. And so that, you know, is always a wild card in all of this. Good news Backlogs for companies continue to be relatively strong. University of Michigan puts out a consumer sentiment report, which is basically, you know, how are they feeling about what's going on? And the score is on a scale of 100.

00:21:53:18 - 00:22:23:17
Unknown
And it was 61 in November and jumped to 69 in December. So people are feeling a little bit better that their wages are covering their food and their rent and things like that. So, you know, I think that those are all relatively positive signs for people that maybe trying to plan for a softer landing is may actually going to happen and there isn't going to be perhaps the catastrophe that we thought there might be a lot more interest in Mexico and Canada.

00:22:23:19 - 00:22:45:00
Unknown
The trading partners that are right here, it's the easiest, you know, So I think companies are picking up on that on the down side of things. As I said, the geopolitical risk, there's an awful lot going on right now. And in their survey, for the first time in quite some time, geopolitical risk overcame talent as the top concern for CEOs.

00:22:45:00 - 00:23:13:18
Unknown
So it's certainly on their mind. The interest rates will probably stay up a little bit. So that's a little bit of a concern. And we're heading into an election year. And any time that there's an election year, heaven knows what could happen. And it doesn't even really matter so much on which party. It's just all kinds of information is going to be being thrown out there and most of it will be negative and that starts to affect people and then it has to settle down again.

00:23:13:18 - 00:23:37:18
Unknown
So I think elections might just be a wild card in all of this for 2024 as well. And like you said, I've had a lot of slides with a lot of great information on them. So so for you to go to MRA's website and watch the reporting there, Jim's got his report, your PDF version on there too. So you look at that, but kind of moving on into church.

00:23:37:18 - 00:24:11:10
Unknown
Now, the last section, you've included some data on population and some projections. You also have a map showing the median age in each state. So this data show. But here's the here's the two takeaways. I would say we had one that looked at people over the age of 65 and people under the age of 18, and those two lines crossed in 2034, meaning at that point we'll start having more people over 65 and actually not shrinking, but leveling off children under 18.

00:24:11:10 - 00:24:29:10
Unknown
And we're living longer. People are sticking around longer. We're not having as many children and it's just sort of, okay, well, so what? And the so what basically means we're going to have fewer people to take care of more people. You know, if you want to really just sort of cut through it all, that's what's about to happen.

00:24:29:10 - 00:24:58:21
Unknown
So we're going to see pretty good growth in the over 60 fives and slide decrease in the under 18. It's common. Beware. The other one was the median age in the states and every state just had a number in it. And northeast Midwest are all in the if not in the forties pushing it 3839. Florida being kind of the outlier in the whole thing for for obvious reasons retirement wise.

00:24:58:23 - 00:25:20:08
Unknown
But this is starting to THRIVE policy now where you're seeing states start to say, well, you know what? So if you if you move to North Carolina, we'll help you with the down payment on your house or we'll get you a better rate on a mortgage or the tri, you know, we'll give you will allow you to deduct your your mortgage percentages from your income tax, whatever it might be.

00:25:20:10 - 00:25:38:19
Unknown
They're trying to set up tax policy and other types of incentives that say if we can get people to come and build a house, we're probably going to hang on to them. And it's beginning. You know, companies are knowing that they're fighting for that shrinking population group to say, you know, it's great that, you know, Florida might be thinking, hey, we're growing like crazy.

00:25:38:19 - 00:26:01:08
Unknown
And all these 75 year old snowbirds are coming down here. But those are going to be expensive people at some point, you know, just strictly from a health care point of view, a friend, if for no other reason. So it's really starting to THRIVE policy. It's forcing companies then to say, look, if we're in those states where we're already 40 something and going older, what does that mean for our workforce?

00:26:01:08 - 00:26:23:12
Unknown
What do we have to automate? What might have to go someplace else? So I think, you know, the two charts just sort of show two mega trends of things that are happening that, you know, if you're in HR And you're 65 years old, you're thinking, well, that's somebody else's problem. But if you're an hour and you're 30 years old, you're probably thinking, holy smokes, we're going to have to deal with this too.

00:26:23:14 - 00:26:42:07
Unknown
So it's just another one that's that's out there on the horizon. So a couple of things to model over during the holidays and have a conversation with your family about, you know, how old is your state and what's it like there. So perfect topic of conversation. Yeah. Yeah. What else do you have to talk about at the house?

00:26:42:09 - 00:27:11:09
Unknown
Well, Jim, as we wrap up, this was the last tailor report of 2023. So how does the report schedule look like for 2024? I think we'll probably be able to bring some different ideas and things to the podcast in 2024. We're changing the format a little bit. We've used a lot of our own subject matter experts from Mirror in 2023, and now we're going to start bringing in companies that maybe are excelling at something.

00:27:11:11 - 00:27:37:15
Unknown
So start out the year we're starting with our artificial intelligence. And so we're going to use a company that's already using it both in their company and their HR And we'll go through the talent report, but we'll also utilize them in terms of their expertise and then we'll talk about internships, but we'll be using companies that have interns and how are they using that as a strategy to develop their next group of leaders and things like that.

00:27:37:15 - 00:27:59:09
Unknown
So you'll get the mirror perspective on what's kind of going on in the big picture. But I think we'll also be able to share with your listeners a little bit more boots on the ground expertise from a company that's actually practicing whatever we're talking about that day. Well, I'm excited. It sounds like a good start to 2024, so make sure you tune in, everybody.

00:27:59:11 - 00:28:26:21
Unknown
You're bet. And thank you for all that great content today. And kind of recapping what you've been seeing in business with an emphasis on talent in December. To our listeners, if you liked our chat and topic today, don't forget to share out this episode and consider joining MRA. If you aren't a member already. Like always, we have the resources in the show notes below, including resources on this talent report and the 2024 Talent Report schedule.

00:28:26:23 - 00:28:47:00
Unknown
Otherwise, thanks for tuning in and we will see you next week. And that wraps up our content for this episode. Be sure to reference the show notes where you can sign them to connect for more podcast updates, check out other MRA episodes on your favorite podcast platform. And as always, make sure to follow MRA's 30 minutes THRIVE so you don't miss out.

00:28:47:01 - 00:28:51:18
Unknown
Thanks for tuning in and we'll see you next Wednesday to carry on the conversation.