Mental Chatter

Beyond Leaning In

In today’s episode of BEYOND LEANING IN, we listen to an excerpt from the book following Amber as she finds herself at a neighbor barbecue in a conversation about the risks that women are constantly calculating in their heads. Spoiler alert: The women at the BBQ don’t feel the same way as the men. Then Melanie sits down with a former college classmate, certified psychologist Dr. Huong Diep, who works with BIPOC and LGBTQ communities and specializes in global mental health, to talk about the concept of mental chatter. They discuss what mental chatter is, just how common it is, why women and people of color often have an extra layer, how it connects to imposter syndrome and how Dr. Diep helps her clients recognize mental chatter and combat its negative effects. Join this conversation now!

Welcome to BEYOND LEANING IN, a podcast designed to inspire candid discussion about gender gaps in the workplace. All too often, the “real talk” about the challenges that professional women face happens behind closed doors. Author Melanie Ho is on a mission to change that through her new book, BEYOND LEANING IN. She is joined in this podcast by co-host Carla Hickman as the two longtime friends discuss the ideas and research that inform Melanie’s book. You will also be invited to listen and join the conversation with early readers, women and men across generations and a wide range of professions, as they reflect, discuss and debate the ideas in the book. Also, don’t forget to get a copy of BEYOND LEANING IN in any of its formats, now available on Amazon.

Resources

How Reading Fiction Increases Empathy and Encourages Understanding

Training to Stop Anti-Asian/Amerian and Xenophobic Harassment

Get the book Beyond Leaning In by Melanie Ho

See and share Melanie’s 31 Days of #BeyondLeaningIn Webcomics

Follow Melanie Ho on Instagram or Twitter

Follow Carla Hickman on Instagram or Twitter

Thanks for joining us today! Don’t forget to visit our website for more information, and feel free to reach out to contribute to these important discussions. This show has been produced by StudioPod Media.

Jump straight into:

(01:52) - Book Excerpt: Amber finds herself in a conversation about the risks women are constantly on guard about - “In the workplace, you didn't have to worry about whether someone was going to slip something in your coffee, or if a potential perpetrator was hiding behind a corner, most of the time anyway, but you still had to be constantly on your guard.”

(08:10) - Dr. Huong Diep on mental chatter - “Definitely for marginalized communities, that chatter is much louder and oftentimes that's what leads to additional fatigue.”

(11:46) - Good mental chatter and bad mental chatter - “Our brains are programmed for survival, not actually for happiness. So it's always scanning the environment, looking for negativity. In terms of the chatter, it developed as a manager to protect us from situations that might be threatening.”

(14:22) - Second-guessing yourself - “Unfortunately, our brains will go looking for experiences and things to kind of confirm certain negative beliefs about ourselves.”

(17:11) - Imposter syndrome and cognitive-behavioral therapy - “The ironic part is that the higher level you get, in education or the more amazing your CV is, the more imposter syndrome you have and that really cuts across the board.”

(25:49) - Processing thoughts and emotions - “As we grow up we categorize certain emotions and we don't allow ourselves to fully feel these emotions and the emotions really start off physiologically too.”

(29:20) - Fear of change and basic emotional intelligence - “At the end of the day, we're pretty basic animals; we want to make sure we were fed, we want to make sure we have a roof over our head and we want to make sure we're taking care of our yard.”

(34:46) - Dr. Huong Diep’s takeaways from reading BEYOND LEANING IN - “I think there are certain things I accepted because I thought that was part of the path to becoming a doctor or a psychologist and those are the dues I had to pay.”

(36:15) - Carla and Melanie on how fiction can build empathy - “One of my hopes with BEYOND LEANING IN was actually to do a little bit of the emotional labor that women often find themselves doing when they have to explain that mental chatter and why the small slights actually make a difference.”

(40:26) - The problem with the terms bias and microaggressions - “These are the right technical terms and I think it's important to say that they are powerful terms. On the other hand, it's sometimes unproductive because people do shut down when they hear them.”