Alternative Investments | Part Two: How Can They Mitigate Risk in Your Portfolio?

Unfiltered Finance

Alternative Investments are not just "cool" or intriguing products to own. In truth, they have the potential to help you endure tumultuous markets. In this episode, we are joined once again by Philip McDonald, CFA, CAIA, Managing Director of Research Investments & Portfolio Manager, to discuss how Alternative Investments can mitigate risk in your portfolio.

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Symmetry Partners, LLC, is an investment advisory firm registered with the Securities and Exchange Commission. The firm only transacts business in states where it is properly registered, excluded or exempted from registration requirements. Registration of an investment adviser does not imply any specific level of skill or training and does not constitute an endorsement of the firm by the Commission. No one should assume that future performance of any specific investment, investment strategy, product or non-investment related content made reference to directly or indirectly in this material will be profitable. As with any investment strategy, there is the possibility of profitability as well as loss. Due to various factors, including changing market conditions and/or applicable laws, the content may not be reflective of current opinions or positions. Please note the material is provided for educational and background use only. Moreover, you should not assume that any discussion or information contained in this material serves as the receipt of, or as a substitute for, personalized investment advice.

0 00:00:06.890 --> 00:00:09.120 Hello, this is Tom Romano with Unfiltered Finance.

1 00:00:09.270 --> 00:00:13.400 Welcome back to part two on our discussion of alternative investments here with

2 00:00:13.400 --> 00:00:14.360 us as Phil McDonald,

3 00:00:14.430 --> 00:00:18.720 portfolio Manager and managing Director of Investments at Symmetry Partners.

4 00:00:18.720 --> 00:00:19.760 Phil, welcome back.

5 00:00:20.020 --> 00:00:21.400 Thanks for having me back. Tom,

6 00:00:21.880 --> 00:00:24.880 I think we're getting a lot of questions from investors and and advisors because

7 00:00:24.880 --> 00:00:28.000 of the fact that you look at the performance of some of these alternative asset

8 00:00:28.000 --> 00:00:30.920 classes in a year like 2022. However,

9 00:00:31.640 --> 00:00:35.680 I think we would caution our listeners to, to not chase returns,

10 00:00:35.860 --> 00:00:40.040 and it's more of a strategic allocation that you wanna hold in your portfolio

11 00:00:40.140 --> 00:00:41.120 for a long duration.

12 00:00:41.600 --> 00:00:44.920 I would totally agree with that. And, and you have other considerations here,

13 00:00:44.920 --> 00:00:48.280 like broadly speaking, the expectation of the 60 40 portfolio,

14 00:00:48.300 --> 00:00:49.920 the return on the so-called 60 port,

15 00:00:49.930 --> 00:00:54.680 40 portfolio is likely going to be below average for in, in the near future.

16 00:00:54.780 --> 00:00:56.320 So you start to think about like, okay,

17 00:00:56.320 --> 00:01:00.200 my traditional portfolio isn't gonna return, you know, the 40 year average,

18 00:01:00.350 --> 00:01:03.080 what we saw decades ago. So where else might I be,

19 00:01:03.080 --> 00:01:06.280 might be able to go for returns and diversification? So you,

20 00:01:06.300 --> 00:01:10.440 you have that inflation surprises, you have increased correlation of,

21 00:01:10.460 --> 00:01:12.920 of traditional asset classes in the recent past. You know,

22 00:01:12.920 --> 00:01:16.360 of all these things kind of pointing to the benefit of having a diversified

23 00:01:16.710 --> 00:01:18.880 alternative strategy. And I would agree with you,

24 00:01:18.920 --> 00:01:22.280 I think you were alluding to the strength of 2022. It was,

25 00:01:22.300 --> 00:01:24.880 it was a very good year for certain alternative strategies.

26 00:01:25.000 --> 00:01:27.880 I would encourage people to think of that as an outlier year like that.

27 00:01:27.880 --> 00:01:31.280 That's not a year that can necessarily happen again unless all the bad things

28 00:01:31.280 --> 00:01:36.080 that happen in the equity and fixed income markets and with inflation kind of

29 00:01:36.490 --> 00:01:40.720 recur. So I, I would encourage people to almost think in terms of sharp ratio,

30 00:01:40.770 --> 00:01:43.600 right? So an excess return for a given volatility,

31 00:01:43.920 --> 00:01:47.320 a sharp ratio above 0.5, getting to maybe a 0.8, is,

32 00:01:47.340 --> 00:01:50.320 is the type of realm I think you should think of for,

33 00:01:50.380 --> 00:01:53.000 for a diversified alternative strategy. And,

34 00:01:53.180 --> 00:01:55.160 and to kind of put specifics on that,

35 00:01:55.380 --> 00:02:00.360 so something that has is managed to a 10% volatility or standard deviation that

36 00:02:00.360 --> 00:02:05.240 would be a five to 8% excess return on the risk-free rate. So,

37 00:02:05.660 --> 00:02:10.080 so you know, you're talking single digit excess returns for, uh,

38 00:02:10.200 --> 00:02:14.040 a strategy that's scaled to a 10% volatility. So, you know,

39 00:02:14.100 --> 00:02:16.480 to take people out of this expectation of,

40 00:02:16.780 --> 00:02:21.640 of a home run year kind of happening again, it's less likely to happen again.

41 00:02:21.660 --> 00:02:22.493 Gotcha.

42 00:02:22.900 --> 00:02:25.560 Um, just to clarify some of that, because I think that's some,

43 00:02:25.670 --> 00:02:28.880 some very important advice there. When we talk sharp ratio,

44 00:02:28.880 --> 00:02:32.000 the way I look at that is bang for your buck. Are you,

45 00:02:32.020 --> 00:02:35.960 are you getting the return for the risk that you are taking?

46 00:02:36.300 --> 00:02:37.720 And the higher the sharp ratio,

47 00:02:37.740 --> 00:02:39.800 the greater the return is for the risk that you're taking.

48 00:02:40.540 --> 00:02:44.800 And so when we're talking about, you know, years like 2022, which is an outlier,

49 00:02:44.810 --> 00:02:46.640 which I would agree, you know,

50 00:02:46.640 --> 00:02:51.640 investors could have alternatives in their portfolio for years with a trade off

51 00:02:51.640 --> 00:02:51.880 being,

52 00:02:51.880 --> 00:02:55.720 you might be getting single digit returns while the markets may be producing

53 00:02:55.720 --> 00:02:59.930 double digit returns. We don't know when the next 20, 22, 2 is gonna happen.

54 00:03:00.420 --> 00:03:05.280 But having an allocation of those alts will certainly help weather that storm.

55 00:03:05.820 --> 00:03:07.280 Uh, uh, totally agree. Yes.

56 00:03:07.380 --> 00:03:11.160 So I think a misconception here, and this is just from my conversations with,

57 00:03:11.160 --> 00:03:13.600 with advisors, investors alike, they think alternative strategies,

58 00:03:13.600 --> 00:03:15.000 they think returns. Mm-hmm.

59 00:03:15.080 --> 00:03:18.440 They think even tactical shifts into and hour. Exactly. Yeah.

60 00:03:18.460 --> 00:03:22.000 But what I'm hearing you say that this is more of a risk mitigating strategy

61 00:03:22.190 --> 00:03:24.000 than a return reaching strategy.

62 00:03:24.520 --> 00:03:28.080 I think it's, it's strongly risk mitigating from a diversification standpoint,

63 00:03:28.260 --> 00:03:30.320 but I'm not quite sure how

64 00:03:31.990 --> 00:03:34.760 Much you have to give up in returns. Okay. I mean, it,

65 00:03:34.880 --> 00:03:38.640 I I wouldn't necessarily say it, it's gonna hurt you over the long term.

66 00:03:38.760 --> 00:03:42.240 I think you need to think about the right portfolio you, you want to be in. And,

67 00:03:42.460 --> 00:03:46.000 you know, I dunno if you had a question here, but, uh, you know, there,

68 00:03:46.000 --> 00:03:50.200 there are some very specific use cases that I think make sense and that would be

69 00:03:50.520 --> 00:03:52.960 managing just the life cycle,

70 00:03:53.380 --> 00:03:58.280 how financial plans and asset allocations change as a person ages. Again,

71 00:03:58.380 --> 00:04:03.080 we, we have a finite kinda life here where we're earning and spending and maybe

72 00:04:03.080 --> 00:04:08.080 bequeathing and then preferences. So theoretically, as someone ages,

73 00:04:08.080 --> 00:04:11.640 they're the, the risk of their portfolio should, should come down over time.

74 00:04:11.640 --> 00:04:13.680 They're converting their human capital,

75 00:04:13.690 --> 00:04:17.200 their potential for earning during their career into financial capital.

76 00:04:17.200 --> 00:04:20.160 They're investing that hopefully they're being thoughtful about the

77 00:04:20.160 --> 00:04:23.760 diversification of, of, of those kind of two buckets and say,

78 00:04:23.760 --> 00:04:25.680 equity beta should come down as you age.

79 00:04:25.930 --> 00:04:28.080 Where do you go with that allocation in your portfolio?

80 00:04:28.640 --> 00:04:32.240 Historically and traditionally, someone would say, oh, fixed, fixed income,

81 00:04:32.240 --> 00:04:35.880 of course. But we've been seeing for a decade, you and I right,

82 00:04:35.930 --> 00:04:37.680 we're we're both nodding and smiling.

83 00:04:38.250 --> 00:04:43.120 There have been times when people were strongly opposed to increasing the fixed

84 00:04:43.120 --> 00:04:47.120 income allocation in their portfolio. So if it's just, you know, gas and break,

85 00:04:47.180 --> 00:04:49.360 you know, what do you do? You, you know,

86 00:04:49.360 --> 00:04:52.720 we've seen investors and advisors kind of freeze and, and say, oh,

87 00:04:52.720 --> 00:04:56.080 there's no solution here. But this third or fourth, right,

88 00:04:56.080 --> 00:05:00.560 with cash in the consideration bucket of allocation really opens things up.

89 00:05:00.620 --> 00:05:04.480 You can take down beta risk, uh, equity beta,

90 00:05:04.500 --> 00:05:09.000 and you can allocate and diversify not only into fixed income.

91 00:05:09.300 --> 00:05:10.100 Gotcha.

92 00:05:10.100 --> 00:05:13.640 And you, you know, we, I joke around saying it depends, right? We,

93 00:05:13.660 --> 00:05:18.080 we say that a lot here, um, because I also think it's a perfect portfolio.

94 00:05:18.340 --> 00:05:21.200 You know, we, we look at portfolios as being a series of trade offs.

95 00:05:21.580 --> 00:05:23.360 And so I immediately think, well gosh, you know,

96 00:05:23.360 --> 00:05:25.000 if you don't really give up any of the return,

97 00:05:25.000 --> 00:05:29.480 but you can definitely mitigate some of the risks through sharp ratio,

98 00:05:29.480 --> 00:05:32.920 as you said, like looking at that particular statistic, who,

99 00:05:32.920 --> 00:05:35.960 what are the trade-offs of, of investing in alternatives? And,

100 00:05:35.960 --> 00:05:38.920 and immediately I think, well, well, you're still, there's still cost,

101 00:05:39.030 --> 00:05:42.840 even though you can get lower cost alternative exposures,

102 00:05:42.840 --> 00:05:47.400 there's still a cost element to that. Um, and also, you know,

103 00:05:47.400 --> 00:05:50.320 we talk a lot about tracking error on the behavioral side, right?

104 00:05:50.380 --> 00:05:53.680 If you're gonna add an alternative asset class to your portfolio,

105 00:05:54.660 --> 00:05:58.080 but you're honed in on the s and p 500, you're,

106 00:05:58.080 --> 00:06:00.040 you're not gonna be tracking that index.

107 00:06:00.690 --> 00:06:01.220 Right?

108 00:06:01.220 --> 00:06:03.120 Is that, is that a correct way of thinking about it?

109 00:06:03.370 --> 00:06:04.040 Absolutely.

110 00:06:04.040 --> 00:06:07.600 And I'm glad you brought that up because not only are alternatives difficult to

111 00:06:07.600 --> 00:06:11.720 benchmark, there are some indices that I think, um, are,

112 00:06:11.740 --> 00:06:16.320 are relevant to a diversified, you know, conservative strategy. We, we,

113 00:06:17.220 --> 00:06:19.880 you know, we run an alternative strategy, uh,

114 00:06:19.880 --> 00:06:24.120 in different forms that is not seeking to, to be very volatile, right?

115 00:06:24.180 --> 00:06:28.040 So sub under that 10% volatility that I gave as,

116 00:06:28.180 --> 00:06:32.680 as the example to conceptualize a sharp ratio. So we, we,

117 00:06:32.740 --> 00:06:34.560 we don't even believe in a, uh,

118 00:06:34.560 --> 00:06:38.040 that high level of volatility in an alternative strategy. Um,

119 00:06:38.060 --> 00:06:39.280 but you raise a very good point.

120 00:06:39.300 --> 00:06:42.120 So not only are alternatives difficult to benchmark,

121 00:06:42.740 --> 00:06:44.880 but if you have alternatives in your portfolio,

122 00:06:45.860 --> 00:06:49.880 the appropriate benchmark for your portfolio should reflect

123 00:06:50.660 --> 00:06:55.480 the allocation you have. If it's 50% diversified equity,

124 00:06:56.770 --> 00:06:59.800 40% diversified fixed income, and 10% alts,

125 00:07:00.380 --> 00:07:04.880 you should probably benchmark yourself to a blended benchmark of a

126 00:07:04.880 --> 00:07:07.960 50, 40 10 mix of relevant indices.

127 00:07:08.540 --> 00:07:11.920 Not just look to the s and p 500, because again,

128 00:07:11.940 --> 00:07:14.440 you probably have a 0.5 beta in that portfolio.

129 00:07:14.980 --> 00:07:18.440 You don't want to compare yourself to something that is a 1.0 beta.

130 00:07:18.790 --> 00:07:22.880 Sure, sure. Absolutely. And you know, we, we talk a lot about, on this podcast,

131 00:07:23.480 --> 00:07:26.680 a lot of folks look at benchmarks to look at the performance, their portfolio,

132 00:07:26.740 --> 00:07:28.800 and I think that makes a lot of sense. But the true one,

133 00:07:28.800 --> 00:07:32.000 true benchmark is are you hitting your goals from a financial planning

134 00:07:32.000 --> 00:07:34.800 standpoint? Right? And so I think that's a better way to, to,

135 00:07:34.820 --> 00:07:38.640 to look at it versus just making sure that you may or may not be

136 00:07:38.990 --> 00:07:40.520 outperforming the s and p,

137 00:07:40.520 --> 00:07:44.400 which is a very visible benchmark out in the world today.

138 00:07:44.420 --> 00:07:47.560 And we can think the media outlets for that certainly. Right.

139 00:07:47.740 --> 00:07:50.680 So let's talk a little about, uh, allocation to alts, right?

140 00:07:50.680 --> 00:07:54.280 Let's say you have an investor, let's say it's 60% stock, 40% bond,

141 00:07:54.280 --> 00:07:58.400 maybe a small cash position in there. How should that investor consider adding,

142 00:07:58.820 --> 00:08:01.720 uh, alternatives to the portfolio? Is there a maximum amount you would put in?

143 00:08:01.740 --> 00:08:04.720 Is there a minimum amount? Would you take it from the stock side?

144 00:08:04.720 --> 00:08:07.440 Would you take it from the bond side? How does that work? And how should our,

145 00:08:07.460 --> 00:08:10.320 our listeners be conceptualizing adding that asset

146 00:08:10.320 --> 00:08:13.720 Class? So we, we have some opinions here, but I think in the end, it's,

147 00:08:13.720 --> 00:08:17.960 it's gonna be what is acceptable to the investor and what their financial

148 00:08:17.960 --> 00:08:22.520 advisors would recommend start the starting point matters.

149 00:08:22.900 --> 00:08:27.200 So if you're exceptionally conservative to start, say you're,

150 00:08:28.320 --> 00:08:31.980 you know, 10% equity in 90% fixed income,

151 00:08:32.260 --> 00:08:37.020 I think taking it ha having a a higher allocation alt might

152 00:08:37.450 --> 00:08:41.780 make more sense than if you were starting from the other end. So, uh,

153 00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:45.500 in terms of the distribution of returns and, and you know,

154 00:08:45.500 --> 00:08:47.980 the level of volatility of a diversified AL strategy,

155 00:08:48.250 --> 00:08:51.180 it's a little bit more similar to fixed income. It's, it's,

156 00:08:51.260 --> 00:08:54.540 I like to say those returns are fueled by different things. You know, it's not,

157 00:08:55.260 --> 00:08:59.200 you know, duration and credit risk and illiquidity type of stuff.

158 00:08:59.270 --> 00:09:02.840 It's other drivers that, that give you returns and alternatives.

159 00:09:02.860 --> 00:09:06.480 But our rules of thumb, which, you know, are for people to take or leave,

160 00:09:06.490 --> 00:09:11.000 would be maybe up to about 25% if you're starting from a very conservative, uh,

161 00:09:11.000 --> 00:09:14.800 portfolio. And if you're starting from a very aggressive portfolio,

162 00:09:14.830 --> 00:09:18.240 just say someone's a hundred percent equity invested in says, ah,

163 00:09:18.240 --> 00:09:22.160 I want to add malts to this portfolio, but I don't like fixed income. Um,

164 00:09:22.360 --> 00:09:23.480 I know a few of those, maybe,

165 00:09:24.210 --> 00:09:26.560 Maybe something more in the realm of 15%,

166 00:09:26.800 --> 00:09:31.560 I think lower than 10% allocation of anything to the portfolio is gonna have a,

167 00:09:32.120 --> 00:09:35.760 a, a limited effect on, on the outcome, right?

168 00:09:35.940 --> 00:09:40.200 So 10 percent's probably our general starting point to add something and, and,

169 00:09:40.260 --> 00:09:43.840 and see, uh, beneficial effect to the portfolio and,

170 00:09:43.980 --> 00:09:46.080 and where we've landed on where to fund it from.

171 00:09:46.080 --> 00:09:47.640 So I didn't forget that part of your question,

172 00:09:48.290 --> 00:09:52.560 where believers in prorata from the,

173 00:09:52.700 --> 00:09:53.720 the asset allocation,

174 00:09:54.260 --> 00:09:58.080 so if you're a 60 40 investor and you put say,

175 00:09:58.080 --> 00:09:59.560 20% alternatives,

176 00:10:00.010 --> 00:10:04.880 60% of that should be probably funded from a reduction in inequity

177 00:10:05.060 --> 00:10:07.960 and 40% from a reduction in fixed. And they go, again,

178 00:10:07.960 --> 00:10:12.320 these are starting rules of thumbs. I I am very familiar with people who,

179 00:10:12.910 --> 00:10:17.400 because that returns distribution to alts, you know, the volatility and the,

180 00:10:17.540 --> 00:10:22.520 and kind of the average return to the distribution to alts is a little

181 00:10:22.520 --> 00:10:24.520 more similar to fixed income than it is to equity.

182 00:10:24.760 --> 00:10:29.160 I know folks who want to take 100% on a fixed income, that is an approach,

183 00:10:29.420 --> 00:10:33.800 but if you think about that, you've done nothing to reduce your equity risk.

184 00:10:34.220 --> 00:10:37.920 So if someone is, again, aging life cycle is a consideration here,

185 00:10:38.760 --> 00:10:41.840 diversifying both systematic, traditional,

186 00:10:41.840 --> 00:10:43.600 systematic exposures of equity and fixed,

187 00:10:44.660 --> 00:10:48.160 we think taking from both makes a lot of sense to fund that ALT's position.

188 00:10:48.410 --> 00:10:50.640 There are exceptions, you know, there, there are, you know,

189 00:10:50.690 --> 00:10:54.560 there are people who have different savings or different, you know,

190 00:10:54.560 --> 00:10:58.880 sources of income, maybe people with three pensions, you know, like who, uh,

191 00:10:58.980 --> 00:11:02.280 who look a little different from an average investor. So again,

192 00:11:02.280 --> 00:11:04.840 individual specifics need to come into play, but those,

193 00:11:04.840 --> 00:11:07.720 those are my starting rules of thumb in a vacuum.

194 00:11:08.070 --> 00:11:09.160 Well, that makes a lot of sense,

195 00:11:09.160 --> 00:11:13.640 especially if you're looking at alternatives as a third leg to the stool, right.

196 00:11:13.660 --> 00:11:14.600 Stocks and bonds.

197 00:11:14.740 --> 00:11:18.160 And if the third category is going to be alternative asset classes or

198 00:11:18.160 --> 00:11:20.760 alternative strategies, it should come out prorata.

199 00:11:21.150 --> 00:11:24.160 It's not that the ALS are taking the place of equities or fixed income,

200 00:11:24.190 --> 00:11:26.880 it's something completely, completely different in the portfolio.

201 00:11:27.300 --> 00:11:28.133 Yep.

202 00:11:28.230 --> 00:11:32.480 Fantastic. So, um, Phil, I wanna thank you so much for your time. This is, uh,

203 00:11:32.500 --> 00:11:36.440 uh, super enlightening and just to kind of recap what we discussed, uh,

204 00:11:36.440 --> 00:11:38.000 for our listeners, um,

205 00:11:38.000 --> 00:11:42.040 alternative investments are a great way to diversify a portfolio beyond stocks,

206 00:11:42.280 --> 00:11:43.113 bonds, and cash.

207 00:11:43.690 --> 00:11:48.400 There are ways to get exposures to liquid alternative strategies through

208 00:11:48.670 --> 00:11:50.920 ETFs and mutual funds. With that should,

209 00:11:51.020 --> 00:11:54.920 you should expect a level of transparency to make sure you are getting those

210 00:11:54.920 --> 00:11:59.720 diversification benefits and, uh, certainly, uh, liquidity being a,

211 00:11:59.980 --> 00:12:04.240 uh, a factor there as well. And you know, whether or not alternatives are,

212 00:12:04.240 --> 00:12:07.560 are suitable for you, as we always say and unfiltered finance. You know,

213 00:12:07.560 --> 00:12:10.320 the best advice we can give is to always work with a financial advisor or

214 00:12:10.320 --> 00:12:14.760 financial professional that can take a look at your own personal situation,

215 00:12:15.060 --> 00:12:18.880 assess that situation, and, uh, make sure that they recommend, uh,

216 00:12:18.880 --> 00:12:21.520 an asset allocation, uh, that's suitable for you.

217 00:12:21.810 --> 00:12:24.520 Thank you listeners for joining us today. Uh, Phil, once again,

218 00:12:24.870 --> 00:12:27.760 it's always fun having you on the show. We'll certainly have you back. Great.

219 00:12:27.760 --> 00:12:28.593 Thanks for having me.

220 00:12:29.020 --> 00:12:31.160 For those of you who are looking for additional information,

221 00:12:31.160 --> 00:12:35.920 you can always visit our [e-mail]. Feel free to,

222 00:12:36.340 --> 00:12:38.080 uh, listen to this podcast, uh,

223 00:12:38.090 --> 00:12:42.200 again or access any of our previous podcasts to the, uh,

224 00:12:42.330 --> 00:12:44.120 venue in which you get your podcasts.

225 00:12:44.460 --> 00:12:46.440 So thanks for listening and we'll catch you next time.

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