Roxy and Katelyn grew up in the white evangelical American heartland. Both were warned moving to a supposed bastion of secular culture would be dangerous to their faith. While navigating a city where people sleep in on Sunday mornings and the chaste motto “true love waits” isn’t a thing, the two have found a renewed, vibrant faith that has been both strengthened and stretched in the metropolis.
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How Should I Manage My Money? Tell Katelyn What to Do with Her Life, Part III
40:00
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Meeting a man. Moving apartments. Literally just moving. Maybe it’s a product of living in NYC, but it seems like you can’t walk outside your door these days without dropping mad cash. It has recently occurred to Katelyn that, whatever big life decisions she makes, they will assuredly require some financial investment. Experts say by age 40, you sh…
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Where to Find a Man? Tell Katelyn What to Do with Her Life, Part II
46:35
46:35
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Behold…the power of man-ifesting. She’s been on the apps. She’s been to church events. She even went to a speed dating mixer with Roxy back in the day. So maybe it’s time Katelyn mix up her straight in her search for romance. Manifesting—the belief that our thoughts determine our futures—grows out of the positive thinking movement and has a distinc…
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Where Should I Live?: Tell Katelyn What To Do with Her Life, Part I
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Remember when people used to throw “over the hill” parties when folks turned 40? Katelyn doesn’t feel over the hill, but she’s also aging out of the young adult church group, if you know what we mean. A milestone birthday is a great time to reflect on the life you’ve built and the person you’re becoming and want to become. That’s what this SBTC spe…
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In the late '80s, a historical romance pro named Francine Rivers became a Christian, and decided to combine her creative interests with her newfound faith. The result is Redeeming Love, a runaway hit that repackaged a few verses from the Book of Hosea into a historical romance complete with trauma, betrayal, sex and more trauma. Tyler is joined by …
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It's Time to Move On From the Nuclear Family + Rhaina Cohen
51:56
51:56
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After you have spent most of your adult life single, as we have, you recognize the importance of building a network of friends who are more than just brunch buddies. You need those friends who send you soup when you're sick and offer their couch for days on end after a breakup and are more than happy to sit in the hospital waiting room while you re…
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We're Losing Pastors Left & Right + Rich Villodas
46:49
46:49
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Why is it a tough time to be a pastor? Let's count the ways: a pandemic, a racial justice uprising, an insurrection, hyper partisanship in the pews, cataclysmic global wars. This is not to mention all the normal pulpit pressures, like blurry boundaries, pastoral care, complaining stakeholders, etc, etc. etc. Being a pastor is hard y'all! That's why…
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Of course there's one for women, too. In this episode, Katelyn joins Tyler to discuss Captivating, John and Stasi Eldredge's attempt to do Wild at Heart for girls. We dig into the flipside of the evangelical gender binary of the early '00s to explore what the Christian Macho Man playbook meant for all the damsels they were supposed to be rescuing. …
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Spicy Takes from the World of Religion News
48:17
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A dozen religion journalists walk into a karaoke bar... On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy bring you all the hot takes from the world of Religion News Association. And believe you me, there are some real spicy stories to tell. We've got Julie Roys, from the Roys Report, talking investigative reporting on scandalous religion. Kate Shellnutt, of Chris…
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Women Are Shaking Up the Vatican + Claire Giangravé
53:29
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A synod on synodality? Sign us up! For the past three years, the global Catholic Church has been undergoing a period of discernment. One of the main issues of contention? Women's ordination. Given our interest in women's leadership in Protestant churches, we've been very curious how that conversation happens on the Catholic side. And now that we se…
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Smokin' Hot Christians and Patriotic Bibles + Micha Boyett on the Dream of God
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Limits. Schlimits. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy have a lot to discuss. Like how a certain subset of evangelical Christians decided purity culture was for the birds and swapped it for "real American beauty" (aka: big boobs, apparently?). Or how the KJV is the best complement to the American Constitution (ironic, no?). But, really, we're here to…
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Do you think you’d like the person your parents picked for you? Parents being a part of the dating or courting or marriage process is a pretty old idea that has a history in most cultures. But we’ve dropped it almost completely in the U.S. in favor of finding true love ourselves. In fact, our families — and our churches and our communities and our …
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This episode, Katelyn and Roxy are joined by the GOAT, the legend who arguably started the spiritual podcasting genre, the longtime host of On Being, Krista Tippett. This wide-ranging conversation lingers on some of the more salient questions of our time: What is the role of faith in a technological era? Does religion only divide? How can spiritual…
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Has Politics Poisoned Our Souls? + Michael Wear
46:01
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Another year. Another election heckscape. Would you talk politics on a first date? Nope. No, definitely not. What about on a 10th? Heck no. In this economy? Americans are not happy with the political landscape at the moment and the general mood going into the 2024 election is, to put it mildly, dread. We're exhausted and this presidential race is a…
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Seeking Besties in a Romance-Obsessed World + Laura Tremaine
51:17
51:17
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Maybe the real soulmates are the friends we met along the way. As marriage has become the end-all, be-all relationship, friendships have been relegated to the "nice to have" category. But at a time when loneliness is being labeled an epidemic, we wonder if this paradigm hasn't stranded us all on islands of our own making. Katelyn and Roxy look at t…
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We're all living inside the code. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy recount their brushes with the evangelical bro code — that malignant workplace milieu of religion mixed with patriarchy mixed with entitlement. We discuss the nearly two hundred responses women sent to Katelyn on the topic and unpack the Three B's of the Evangelical Bro Code: Bread…
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The World According to GOOP + Rina Raphael
47:40
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That's poog spelled backward. The wellness industry has scope creep. Is it about health? Self-care? Spirituality? Mud masks? Yes, yes, yes, yes — and so much more. One thing it all seems to have in common though is that it costs money. Marketed primarily to women and promising solutions to every woe, wellness is more in the category of faith than s…
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When God Met Country + Rob Reiner & Dan Partland
48:49
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The Jesus thing always gets in the way. Did you ever think Rob Reiner — director of such favorites as "When Harry Met Sally," "Princess Bride" and "Spinal Tap" — would make a movie about Christian nationalism? Inconceivable, right? Well, that word doesn't mean what you think it means and yes, he did. The documentary, "God & Country," directed by Da…
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ApocryFUN: A Midwinter Series with Tyler Huckabee + Ep. 5: Left Behind
47:12
47:12
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The son has come and you've been ... On each episode of this show, we talk about a popular, influential — or at least lucrative — Christian book from the 90s or 2000s (you know, our era). We discuss how the book shaped American Christianity, our own personal faith journeys, and how it has aged in our current dystopian Christian Nationalist hellscap…
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ApocryFUN: A Midwinter Series with Tyler Huckabee + Ep. 4: Desiring God
37:02
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Are you happy enough? On each episode of this show, we talk about a popular, influential — or at least lucrative — Christian book from the 90s or 2000s (you know, our era). We discuss how the book shaped American Christianity, our own personal faith journeys, and how it has aged in our current dystopian Christian Nationalist hellscape. In this epis…
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ApocryFUN: A Midwinter Series with Tyler Huckabee + Ep. 3: Purpose Driven Life
50:52
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This podcast will change your life. On each episode of this show, we talk about a popular, influential — or at least lucrative — Christian book from the 90s or 2000s (you know, our era). We discuss how the book shaped American Christianity, our own personal faith journeys, and how it has aged in our current dystopian Christian Nationalist hellscape…
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ApocryFUN: A Midwinter Series with Tyler Huckabee + Ep. 2: Wild at Heart
50:25
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Paintball never looked so holy. On each episode of this show, we talk about a popular, influential — or at least lucrative — Christian book from the 90s or 2000s (you know, our era). We discuss how the book shaped American Christianity, our own personal faith journeys, and how it has aged in our current dystopian Christian Nationalist hellscape. In…
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ApocryFUN: A Midwinter Series with Tyler Huckabee + Ep. 1: Blue Like Jazz
41:55
41:55
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41:55
Cozy up for this time traveling book club. On each episode of this show, we talk about a popular, influential — or at least lucrative — Christian book from the 90s or 2000s (you know, our era). We discuss how the book shaped American Christianity, our own personal faith journeys, and how it has aged in our current dystopian Christian Nationalist he…
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Self-Help Wisdom You Won't See on Instagram + Liz Forkin Bohannon
53:36
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Decadent December is coming to a close and bills are due. Every year, we all get a little excited for what a new start could bring — who could I be this year? Surely this year, I'll do the thing. Or stop doing the thing. Or change everything. Right? When it comes to making goals, setting intentions, naming desires, we're as all-in as anybody ... bu…
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Grief Is Hell. Friends Make It Less Awful. + J.S. Park
45:01
45:01
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Be good to your people. The holidays are hard for the grieving. This year, as Roxy and her family walk through their first Christmas without her dad, we wanted to do an episode on what has helped get them through. Well, who has helped really. This is an episode on the power of community and friendship when life hands you loss. Katelyn and Roxy are …
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It's the new evangelical Vatican y'all. Before there was New York City, both Katelyn and Roxy flirted with Nashville. The draw was real: deep friendship, like-minded value systems, shared faith, the prospect of financial stability. But something never quite clicked. Nashville felt maybe a little ... too comfortable, too safe, even a bit stifling. I…
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Mushrooms and Misbehaving Men + Gloria Purvis on Black Lives Matter
48:33
48:33
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The range of a religion reporter. This week, we ask ourselves: would we do mushrooms for research? Plus, a journey from Kansas to Tennessee to California and their multiple misbehaving men in ministry. Katelyn and Roxy discuss the similarities and patterns present in congregations where clergy can get away with almost anything. And we're joined by …
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Best of: The Revolutionary Power of a Shared Meal + Alissa Wilkinson
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45:37
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For this Thanksgiving, we return to a favorite episode about food, hosting and the power of conversations around a dinner table.By Religion News Service
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The Menfolk Aren't Doing So Hot. Why Should We Care?
43:39
43:39
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It's a mancession. Or, as one woman put it to our guest today, "men are in their flop era." Men are lagging behind women in almost every measure of success today — from mental health, to education levels, to employment, to sexual satisfaction. What's going on? Katelyn and Roxy are joined (once again!) by columnist and author Christine Emba to discu…
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Why I Chose to Have a Baby on My Own + Annie Parsons
54:07
54:07
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When the clock keeps ticking, you gotta get picking ... a sperm donor, that is. Ok, but really, as more and more women are single into their late thirties and early forties, the option to have a child through in vitro fertilization becomes a very live question. As much as forty may be the new twenty, the biological timeline for many women still loo…
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You Don't Have to Perform for God (Thank God) + Karen Wright Marsh
50:23
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But it is better if you get spiritual in the mornings. For a very long time, spending time with God felt a bit like a chore to be checked off. Remember quiet times? One year Bible reading plans? On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy discussing finding rhythms and rituals that actually work for connecting with God — no guilt attached. And, bonus, actual…
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On Israel, Gaza and the Hope for Peace + Greg Khalil
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"Seek peace and pursue it — especially when it seems impossible." Inspired by these words of his father, our guest today has been working to bring peace in the Holy Land since the early 2000s. The last few weeks have been an onslaught of horrifying news from Israel and Gaza — thousands upon thousands dead, hundreds held hostage, hundreds of thousan…
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Childhood Faith: The Cringe, The Cute, The Complicated + Esau McCaulley
52:02
52:02
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What's on your Jesus Island? Church, God, Christianity — they made up a core part of our identity as kids. In other words, we definitely had a Jesus Island. And, yes, that's a reference to Pixar's highly relatable "Inside Out." This episode of the podcast is full of them. Katelyn and Roxy plumb the depths of their childhood faith and discuss how th…
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What’s With All the Fresh Scorn for Single Women?
35:29
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Why can't you just let us be happy? Recent internet pile ons have made it clear there are a whole lot of people out there — including some academics and sociologists, as well as all the incels — who believe single women are ruining society. Not an exaggeration. Marriage rates are down, birth rates are down, men are reporting all time lows in mental…
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Our Bizarro New World Where Russell Moore Is a 'Liberal' + Russell Moore
47:49
47:49
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And if Russell Moore is a liberal, then what the heck are we? Our first guest for season six has us thinking about institutions. An exciting lead for a season opener, you say? It is! In part because this guest now leads an institution, Christianity Today, that both Katelyn and Roxy have some history with. But, not too long ago, he was an SBC bigwig…
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What the New Hillsong Doc Gets Right ... and Wrong + Janice Lagata
50:30
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... and very messy. It's not everyday Saved by the City hosts Katelyn and Roxy get invited to be on documentaries, but it is every Hillsong documentary. The latest documentary treatment of the global megachurch’s descent into scandal recently premiered on FX and Hulu. And it featured our very own Ms. Beaty with some real zingers. It also featured C…
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The Women Who Ran with Jesus + Nijay K. Gupta
48:57
48:57
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Mary, the mentor of Jesus. A lifetime of Bible reading and the women who surrounded Jesus still feel so flat, so much a part of the flannel graph background. Why? In this episode, Katelyn and Roxy explore how their perceptions of the women in the New Testament were formed and why it's still so difficult to conceive of them as real, three-dimensiona…
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ENTP! 2 wing 3! Let's talk about you and me! We'll admit, a podcast episode all about our personalities might be a bit self-indulgent. But also fun! So bear with us as we dive headfirst into the various and sundry methods for categorizing oneself. This week, Katelyn and Roxy go old school (Myers-Briggs), new school (StrengthsFinder) and a little wo…
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What Churches Lose When Women Don't Lead + Rev. Dr. LaKeesha Walrond & Rev. Dr. Serene Jones
48:09
48:09
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Let's go shatter a glass steeple or two, shall we? When it comes to women in ministry, the gains have been ever so gradual. And at the top levels of leadership — from seminary faculty and deans to senior clergy positions — women seem to have hit a wall. Fewer than 25 percent of seminary faculty and deans are women, as are 11 percent of presidents, …
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We Got It From Our Moms + Marcie Alvis Walker (Creator of Black Coffee With White Friends)
54:11
54:11
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You sound like your mother. Is an essential project of a daughter's life trying to understand her mother? On this episode of the podcast — on this week of Mother's Day — we reflect on the lessons we learned from our moms, how we saw them as teens, how we see them now (SPOILER: it's changed). Plus, we are joined by Marcie Alvis Walker in a wide rang…
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Is Youth Group Good for Teen Girls? + Sheila Wray Gregoire
53:04
53:04
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Two words: chubby bunny. From the games that were downright gross to the Mountain Dew fueled lock-ins, youth group culture was its own special kinda weird. But was it good? On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy reminiscence on the lessons we learned as teens in our church basements (we shared a certain oldest daughter perfectionism that youth group cul…
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Who Is In? Who Is Out? Why Evangelicals Love Gatekeeping + Isaac B. Sharp
48:21
48:21
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It's an evangelical origin story. Who are the evangelicals? It's a contested question with a long history of answers — answers that depend largely on who is holding the mic at any given time. In this episode of the podcast, Katelyn and Roxy examine our own roles within the traditional gatekeeping institutions of evangelicalism and reflect on how we…
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Would the Proverbs 31 Woman Get Botox? + Jamie B. Golden
51:20
51:20
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Maybe beauty could be a little less fleeting? This week, Katelyn and Roxy dive face-first into the prickly subject of cosmetic procedures. They're not just for Hollywood stars and Dallas housewives anymore. But just because everyone is getting a little work done, should we? Would the Proverbs 31 woman — the biblical model for all things feminine — …
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Should Megachurch Pastors Make Mega Moolah?
37:24
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Living large on the Lord. $150,000 on a three-day luxury retreat in Cancun. $37,000 on flowers. $13,000 on high tea. $16,000 on custom skateboards. These are just a few of the line items recently uncovered in Hillsong financial statements. Last month, a leader in Australia’s Parliament, armed with 17 binders full of documents, accused Hillsong lead…
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Our Churchiest Episode Ever + Presiding Bishop Michael Curry
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Sometimes going through the motions is the whole point. On this episode, which drops amid Holy Week, Roxy and Katelyn reflect on the beauty, meaning, and mystery they have found in the church liturgy. Instead of feeling rote, the rhythms and prayers of the church have become nourishing for us. Kind of like a favorite meal. They are joined by the Mo…
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We're STILL Deprogramming from '90s Diet Culture + Cole Arthur Riley
48:03
48:03
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But did the era of heroin chic ever really end? Low rise jeans are trying to make a comeback — does that mean the bodies that look good in them must too? (Aka: teensy tiny itty bitty very flat stomach bodies.) On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy explore how the body ideals promoted during our teen years are still informing the way we see our adult bo…
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Let's get a drink sometime! New York's a drinking town. Happy hours. Boozy brunches. Martinis and oysters. The city's social life revolves around artisan cocktails and bubbly toasts and late night dive bars. And while the pandemic may have put a screeching halt to the social side of that life, it didn't stop the flow of booze. Restaurants offered c…
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Faith After Gothard + Jinger Duggar Vuolo
48:34
48:34
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Watch out for the Cabbage Patch Kids! Katelyn and Roxy are back for a new season of Saved By the City and are joined by guest Jinger Duggar Vuolo. Listeners may know her as one of the siblings on the reality TV show “19 Kids and Counting," or maybe from the "Free Jinger" movement online. In addition to her childhood being well-documented, Jinger al…
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Why 'Interfaith' Isn't a Dirty Word +Simran Jeet Singh
49:07
49:07
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Happy holidays! In New York City, the phrase has nothing to do with a culture war and everything to do with being a good neighbor. A recent NY Times article describes the city as "a swirling kaleidoscope of faiths," and living within that colorful milieu has profoundly shaped our posture toward other religions. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy dis…
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2022 in Review: Books! TV! Friendship! Dates! Weird Subway Stuff! + New Year's Goals
33:48
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The year is not over yet but we're ready to hand in the verdict. This week, Katelyn and Roxy reflect on the year that was 2022 (better than 2020!) and share some highlights and lowlights in various categories. Favorite book? Check. Favorite TV show? Yep. Favorite friendship moment? Yes please. Strangest thing you saw on the subway? Of course. Plus,…
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We're OVER the Pastor Power Plays + Diane Langberg
50:11
50:11
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It's been 2000 years. Enough already. Abusing power is an ancient genre of sin — and using religion to justify abuse is perhaps the oldest trick in that book. We know it won't stop with this podcast episode, but, here we go anyway. Katelyn and Roxy address some of the difficulties of identifying spiritual abuse (no, it isn't just "church hurt") and…
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