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Every number tells a story. The problem is that for most people, your finances are an overwhelming, over-complicated mystery that you’ve just never had the time or the energy to unpack. I’m here to help you with that. Hi. I’m Jason Andrew – chartered accountant, business owner and financial voyeurist – and this is Stark Naked Numbers. It’s the podcast that strips down the numbers of business, investing and wealth creation to help you become a better entrepreneur and a better investor, and ul ...
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Law of Code

Jacob Robinson

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The Law of Code podcast focuses on the legal framework being built around blockchains, crypto, NFTs, and DAOs. We’ll look at crypto regulations, rights surrounding NFTs, as well as the legislation impacting blockchain. You’ll hear from the top lawyers, lawmakers, and entrepreneurs in the space – we’ll touch on best practices countries are implementing, new regulations, and share ideas on the best path forward.
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Josh Lawler is a partner at Zuber Lawler, where he leads the firm’s Emerging Technologies Group with a particular emphasis on blockchain technology. Josh previously practiced as a corporate securities and M&A attorney at Skadden, Arps. Jener Sakiri is an associate at Zuber Lawler and focuses on transactional and regulatory matters. He often works w…
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Nick Pullman (@NickPullmanEsq) is Corporate Counsel and founder of Day One Law Corporation, where he provides legal solutions for tech startups and investors. Nick was previously head of legal at an NFT startup and an associate at Cooley and DLA Piper. In this conversation, we cover: [2:53] Nick's introduction to Bitcoin [7:33] What's market: SAFEs…
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Building a successful ecommerce or SaaS business is no small feat – it requires grit, determination, and a strategic mindset. But once you’ve scaled your business, how do you maximise profitability and maintain that upward growth trajectory? G’day, Jason Andrew here, and you’re listening to Stark Naked Numbers. This episode is for all the ecommerce…
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Ever received a cold email that actually made an impact? Today’s guest did just that. Hi, Jason Andrew here, and this is Stark Naked Numbers – the podcast that strips down the numbers of business, investing, and wealth creation to help you become a better entrepreneur and investor, and ultimately build your net worth. Today, I’m joined live in the …
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Bill Hughes (@BillHughesDC) is Senior Counsel & Director of Global Regulatory Matters at Consensys Software, which is behind MetaMask, Infura, and various other software supporting the programmable blockchain ecosystem. For more on Bill’s background, I recommend episode 74 of Law of Code. This conversation is focused on the lawsuit Consensys brough…
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Hey, it’s Jason Andrew here. Today, I'm joined live in the studio by Mark Denning. He’s the owner and managing director of Fallon Solutions, a Brisbane-based home services business that provides trade services to customers in South East Queensland. I actually used their services myself, and let me tell you, it was one of the best customer experienc…
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Ever wondered what it’s like to run a high-octane digital agency? If you’re knee-deep in the digital marketing world, you’re gonna dig this chat. Hey there, Jason Andrew here, and you’re listening to Stark Naked Numbers – the podcast that’s about stripping down the numbers behind business, investing, and wealth creation to help you become a better …
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This conversation with two lawyers — Samir Patel and David Kuhn — and an entrepreneur who goes by OnlyLarping covers all aspects of Karate Combat, a novel form of sports league that is betting heavily on crypto. Show highlights: [2:51] What is Karate Combat? [7:26] Implementing token governance [13:11] Crypto and sports [19:34] Why they believe it …
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Recently, the Blockchain Association (BA) and the Crypto Freedom Alliance of Texas (CFAT) filed a lawsuit against the Securities and Exchange Commission seeking a court order to strike down the SEC’s Dealer Rule due to the SEC’s various Administrative Procedure Act (APA) violations including preventing industry participants from being able to opera…
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Justin Wales (@bitcoin_wales) is the Head of Legal for the Americas at Crypto.com. Before going in-house, he was a partner at the international law firm K&L Gates, where he represented crypto companies in all aspects of their business. His new book, The Crypto Legal Handbook, is a must-read guide through the laws of crypto, web3 and an ever-decentr…
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Today’s podcast covers the case of Roman Sterlingov, a 33-year-old Swedish-Russian national, was arrested by Internal Revenue Service criminal investigators at the Los Angeles airport and was accused of creating and operating Bitcoin Fog, a bitcoin “mixing” service that the US Justice Department claims Sterlingov used to enable $336 million in mone…
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The DeFi Education Fund and co-plaintiff Beba, an apparel company based in Texas, recently filed a pre-enforcement suit challenging the SEC’s regulation by enforcement approach to crypto and their policy that free airdrops are securities transactions. Amanda Tuminelli serves as the DeFi Education Fund's chief legal officer where she leads the organ…
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After the DEF submitted an amicus brief in the Roman Storm matter, which involves Tornado Cash, I spoke with the two authors: Amanda Tuminelli serves as the DeFi Education Fund's chief legal officer where she leads the organization's impact litigation and policy efforts. Jake Chervinsky recently joined Variant as Chief Legal Officer, where he leads…
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Back in my corporate finance days, I was knee-deep in valuations and financial due diligence for small businesses. I always joked with my boss at the time that it was the easiest job ever. Just figure out the profit, or what we finance folks call the normalised EBITDA, and then you multiply it by three. But why three times? Why not two or even ten?…
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Co-founded by longtime cryptolawyers Gabriel Shapiro and Alex Golubitsky, the mission of MetaLeX (which means beyond law) is to combine legal structures and autonomous tech to create best-in-class solutions serving DAOs, devs, and internet denizens with a suite of interoperable autonomous law solutions, which they refer to as MetaLeX OS. The goal i…
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We’ve talked about how to buy a business – but have you ever wondered what the first three to six months should look like for someone who’s just bought one? Hi. Jason Andrew here, and you’re listening to Stark Naked Numbers – the podcast that strips down the numbers of business, investing, and wealth creation to help you become a better entrepreneu…
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Stéphane Daniel (@stephdan_law) is a Partner at d&a partners, an independent law firm dedicated to tech and blockchain entrepreneurs in France and the EU. Stéphane advises high-tech firms with their structuring, fundraising, and M&A transactions. He was notably involved in the first legal structuring (under French law) of DAOs and regularly advises…
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Chris Giancarlo (@giancarloMKTS) is senior counsel and Co-Chair of the Willkie Digital Works practice in the firm’s New York office. Chris served as the thirteenth Chairman of the U.S. CFTC, where he oversaw regulation of the futures, options and swaps derivatives markets. During his tenure at the CFTC (2014-2019), Chris oversaw the first bitcoin f…
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Eric Hess (@hess_legal) is Founder & Managing Counsel at Hess Legal Counsel, a cybersecurity SaaS platform and consulting company, and hosts The Encrypted Economy podcast. In this episode, we’ll be exploring his recent paper Bridging Policy and Practice: A Pragmatic Approach to Decentralized Finance, Risk, and Regulation. For Part 1, a history of s…
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Primavera De Filippi is a Director of Research at the National Center of Scientific Research (CNRS) in Paris, Faculty Associate at the Berkman Klein Center for Internet & Society at Harvard University, and Visiting Fellow at the Robert Schuman Centre for Advanced Studies at the European University Institute. Her research focuses on the legal challe…
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They say you should never meet your heroes, but that’s probably because they never met Dan Norris. Dan’s a serial entrepreneur, an award-winning content marketer, a best-selling author, and a genuine hero of mine. On this episode of the Stark Naked Numbers podcast, Dan tells us about how he developed his transparent approach to content marketing, w…
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Jeffrey T. Dinwoodie is a partner at Cravath, Swaine & Moore, and a member of the firm’s Financial Institutions Group. He has served in senior roles at the SEC and the U.S. Treasury Department, including as Chief Counsel to SEC Chairman Jay Clayton and, earlier, as Chairman Clayton’s Trading and Markets Counsel. Disclaimer: Jacob Robinson and his g…
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Rebecca Rettig, Michael Mosier and Katja Gilman published their paper, Genuine DeFi as Critical Infrastructure: A Conceptual Framework for Combating Illicit Finance Activity in Decentralized Finance and a summary two-pager. This paper proposes a framework (see Section III) to effectively detect, deter and prevent illicit financial activity in DeFi,…
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On August 4, 2023, Coinbase filed a brief in support of its motion to dismiss the SEC's lawsuit. This podcast provides an audio version of the brief, along with key takeaways and points made within it. Show highlights: [1:00] Preliminary Statement [6:30] Background on the SEC's charges [11:30] Coinbase's argument for dismissal [13:00] Because the c…
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Joshua B. Sterling is a Partner at Jones Day where he represents financial services, energy, fintech, agriculture and other companies in matters before the CFTC, the SEC, and other financial regulators. A former senior regulator, Josh was previously the Director of the CFTC’s Market Participants Division. In that role, he oversaw the 3,300 financia…
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Elliott Z. Stein (@NYCStein) is a Senior Litigation Analyst at Bloomberg Intelligence. He previously worked in private practice on structured finance/capital markets litigation, white-collar crime and related capital markets matters. Show highlights: [1:30] Attending Coinbase hearing on Jan 17 [6:00] Why Elliott expects Coinbase to win [12:00] Judg…
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This episode is all about roll-ups – and we’re not talking about the fruit snacks you had in your lunch box as a kid. No, we’re talking about rolling up SMBs. You know the playbook: Buy a bunch of small businesses, whack them together, take it public and make a tonne of money. I’ve been feeling the itch to do some rolling up myself. And this pod, I…
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Today I’m joined live in the studio by Tobi Pearce, the brilliant mind behind the hugely popular Sweat fitness app. Tobi's journey is nothing short of remarkable. He bootstrapped Sweat to a peak of $100 million in annual revenue and eventually orchestrated a jaw-dropping $400 million sale. I’m Jason Andrew, and this is Stark Naked Numbers. It’s the…
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Eric Hess (@hess_legal) is Founder & Managing Counsel at Hess Legal Counsel, a cybersecurity SaaS platform and consulting company, and hosts The Encrypted Economy podcast. Eric has over twenty years of experience acting as senior in-house counsel, general counsel or senior management for exchanges, broker dealers, and financial services technology …
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Evan Zinaman (@zin_esq) is the Founder & Principal at Trailbreak, a boutique transactional firm providing tech-fluent corporate, regulatory, product and IP counsel and strategic advice to startups, builders and investors throughout the crypto space. Evan also serves as special crypto counsel to clients of Reed Smith, advising as part of an industry…
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Rodrigo Seira (@RSSH273) is Special Counsel at Paradigm. Prior to joining Paradigm, he was outside counsel to crypto investors and entrepreneurs at Cooley LLP. Brendan Malone (@brendanpmalone) is a Policy Manager at Paradigm. Prior to joining Paradigm, Brendan worked at the Federal Reserve where he focused on policy issues for financial market infr…
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We often hear stories about entrepreneurs making money, but how do you preserve it or more importantly, ensure your kids don’t waste it? As a parent, how do you ensure you don’t raise soft, entitled brats? Multi-generational wealth doesn’t just happen – and nobody knows more about how to keep your money in the family than today’s guest. I’m Jason A…
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William O’Rorke (@williamororke) is the Founding Partner of ORWL, a leading law firm assisting clients with businesses in the crypto space, VASPs and general Web3 services. He leads the regulatory practice at ORWL and is the head of the legal committee at ADAN, a French crypto association. In this conversation, we discuss the most significant impac…
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Zach Rosenberg (@MeatEsq) is an attorney and principal at Rosehill Legal, a boutique transactional firm assisting early-stage founders, largely in the crypto space, with structuring, funding, building, and deploying products and networks. He previously worked as an M&A Tax Director at PWC where he spent eight years advising large private equity fir…
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Ryne Miller is the founder and managing partner of Miller Strategic Partners LLP, a law firm specializing in: 1. Regulatory advice and investigations counsel for the traditional trading and markets industry; 2. Regulatory and strategic advice for digital asset and blockchain companies; and 3. Crisis and incident response management. Ryne was previo…
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Jolie Yang (@JolieYang) is a former legal partner to Coinbase's product, engineering, and design teams on its Web3 initiatives, such as self-custodial wallet, decentralized identity, digital assets, as product counsel. While at Coinbase, Jolie was part of the team that launched Base. Prior to Coinbase, Jolie was an attorney at Davis Polk and Skadde…
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Amanda Tuminelli (@amandatums) is chief legal officer for the Defi Education Fund, where she leads the organization’s impact litigation and policy efforts. She was previously an attorney at Kobre & Kim and Dechert LLP, and served as a Judicial Law Clerk for the Eastern District of New York. Show highlights: [1:00] DeFi Education Fund's petition to …
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Michael Frisch is a partner at Croke Fairchild Morgan & Beres where he leads the firm’s Government Litigation and Investigations Practice. Mike previously worked at the Commodity Futures Trading Commission (CFTC), where he brought one of the CFTC’s first enforcement actions involving cryptocurrency — CFTC v. Bitfinex — and was part of the team resp…
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Mark Cianci is Counsel at Ropes & Gray, where he represents hedge funds, private equity firms and their portfolio companies, and clients in other industries in complex commercial litigation, cryptocurrency litigation, qui tam actions, bankruptcy litigation, and government investigation and enforcement matters. Mark also counsels clients in the bloc…
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Ashish Chandra is the General Counsel of CoinSwitch, India's largest crypto platform pivoting into a multi-asset wealth-tech superapp. With over 22 years of experience in the tech industry, Ashish also led the legal and regulatory affairs of WhatsApp for India. He helped build the e-commerce and fintech/payments business of Facebook, Instagram & Wh…
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If you’re a small business owner, a founder, or a CEO, there’s one big question I’m sure has echoed in your mind – ”How much should I pay myself?” It’s a delicate balance between personal income and business growth. I’m Jason Andrew – chartered accountant, business owner, and yes, a financial voyeur – and you’re listening to Stark Naked Numbers. It…
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Ross Campbell (@z0r0zzz) is a legal engineer and co-founder of KaliDAO, in addition to being a corporate attorney. Ross is also working on NANI, a protocol mixing AI and crypto and is a founder of LexDAO. Previous episodes with Ross: 1. #5 - Ross Campbell: Legal engineering, Bar Association DAOs, use cases for oracles, and much, much more 2. #30 - …
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Stephen Palley (@stephendpalley) is a litigation partner and co-chair of Brown Rudnick’s Digital Commerce group. Stephen is a seasoned litigator with over 20 years of extensive courtroom experience litigating and trying complex commercial matters. Stephen has written extensively and been quoted widely on legal issues arising from the use of Blockch…
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Amira Valliani (@amiravalliani) is Policy Lead at the Solana Foundation. She previously built and sold a creator economy company and served as an advisor at the White House and State Department. Note that this episode was recorded prior to the Ripple Labs decision. Show highlights: [3:00] Policy work at Solana Foundation [7:00] Change in policy [10…
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Have you ever wondered how the magic of buying a business actually happens? I’m Jason Andrew, and this is Stark Naked Numbers. It’s the podcast that strips down the numbers of business, investing and wealth creation to help you become a better entrepreneur and a better investor, and ultimately build your net worth. In this episode, I unravel the st…
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Offering a masterclass on the Accredited Investor rules, this episode distills months of historic research and detailed reviews of the securities laws, as well as a 3+ hour conversation I had with Larry Florio (@larryflorio), into an evergreen episode providing everything one should know regarding the accredited investor standards in the U.S. and a…
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Cameron B. Pick is a partner at Marshall Gerstein & Borun LLP who advises clients in the blockchain and metaverse space on intellectual property issues. In this episode, Cameron explains Bitcoin Ordinals, the difference between Ordinals and Ethereum NFTs, and the interplay between IP law and web3. Disclaimer: Jacob Robinson and his guests are not y…
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Samir Patel (@SamirPatelLaw) is an innovation and technology attorney in Holland & Knight's Miami office and head of the firm's Document Automation Program. Samir represents startups and emerging growth companies navigating legal and regulatory issues. Samir also works with artists, art galleries and athletes looking to enhance their products and b…
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To bootstrap or not to bootstrap – that is the question. Is it better to build a business from the ground up without any outside funding, or to take the sweet venture capitalist money and run? I’m Jason Andrew, and this is Stark Naked Numbers. It’s the podcast that strips down the numbers of business, investing and wealth creation to help you becom…
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David M. Adlerstein is counsel in the Corporate Department at Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz. His practice focuses on mergers and acquisitions, capital-raising transactions, corporate governance, and other corporate and securities law matters, with a focus on financial institutions and technology transactions. He is a member of the Firm’s Crypto Te…
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