111. Healing Detransition & Dissociation: Can Therapy Help? Bob Withers, Nicolas Blooms, & Layton

You Must Be Some Kind of Therapist

I’ve brought together a panel of two detransitioners and an elder therapist with many years of experience treating transition regret in psychoanalytic psychotherapy. Together, we explore the barriers to effective psychotherapy for individuals experiencing transition regret and the importance of a relational approach in therapy. But what happens when therapists fall into the trap of ego issues and countertransference? How do detransitioners navigate the shame and blame that often accompany their experiences? And what role does the mind-body connection play in healing trauma and emotional wounds? Join us as we uncover the challenges detransitioners face and the need for a holistic approach to mental health care.

Nicolas Blooms describes himself as a Detransitioner and Gender Shaman full of fruity passion to create ways for people to spark the deeper magical wisdom within their hearts to root in their inner resilience. Witness his liberating journey to self-love and remembering his Soul by soaking in his graphic novel, Trans to Detrans: A Soul Solution. He believes it’s totally possible to heal gender dysphoria and any other mental dis-ease! He previously appeared on episode 98. Trans to Detrans: A Graphic Novel Journey from Self-Hate to Self-Compassion, with Nicolas Blooms.

Layton is a detransitioned woman, conversion therapy survivor, artist, and psychic somatic practitioner. She previously appeared on episodes 95. Transing the Gay Away? Cults, Actual Conversion Therapy, & Dissociation: part 1 with Layton, and 96. From Cult to Gender Clinic: Misdiagnosis, Detransition & Healing — Layton, part 2. Follow her on X @origina1ange1 or visit her website at psychicsomatic.com.

Bob Withers is a Jungian analyst with over 35 years’ experience as a psychotherapist. During that time he has worked with several transgender people in various stages of transition and detransition. He has written a series of articles about that work including the 2020 article ‘Transgender Medicalization’. Bob is a former senior lecturer on the University of Westminster’s master’s program, where he specialized in the history and philosophy of the mind/body relationship in medicine. He is also co-founder of The Rock Clinic, a charitable, community based psychotherapy and counseling service in Brighton England, where he lives. He previously appeared on episode 47. The Scapegoated Body: Transition Regret in Psychotherapy with Bob Withers.

All books mentioned on this podcast can be found at sometherapist.com/bookshop or by following the Amazon affiliate links below.

Trans to Detrans: A Soul Solution, by Nicolas Blooms

00:00 Start

[00:00:49] Detransitioners in therapy.

[00:03:54] Complex psychiatric needs in counseling.

[00:07:21] Overcoming mind-body dissociation.

[00:13:30] Suicide narrative discussion.

[00:16:33] The effect of estrogen on suicide.

[00:18:20] Transitioning without therapist guidance.

[00:24:26] Mentorship in therapy relationships.

[00:28:09] Boundaries in therapy.

[00:31:40] Therapist-client relationship dynamics.

[00:35:14] Individualized approach in therapy.

[00:40:22] Challenges in mental health care.

[00:43:14] Bodily care and mental health.

[00:46:10] Trauma stored in the body.

[00:49:39] Somatic experiencing and healing.

[00:55:23] Taking healing into own hands.

[00:59:04] Detransitioning and medical issues.

[01:02:24] The needs of detransitioners.

[01:03:38] Gender dysphoria treatment controversies.

[01:09:35] Gender identity and detransitioning.

[01:13:38] Challenges in therapy dynamics.

[01:14:48] Reintegrating anger after dissociation.

[01:20:45] Hope and healing after trauma.

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SHOW NOTES & transcript with help from SwellAI.

MUSIC: Thanks to Joey Pecoraro for our song, “Half Awake,” used with gratitude & permission.

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Show notes & transcript provided with the help of SwellAI.

Special thanks to Joey Pecoraro for our theme song, “Half Awake,” used with gratitude and permission.

Watch NO WAY BACK: The Reality of Gender-Affirming Care (our medical ethics documentary, formerly known as Affirmation Generation). Stream the film or purchase a DVD. Use code SOMETHERAPIST to take 20% off your order. Follow us on X @2022affirmation or Instagram at